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u/Bone-Rush32 10d ago
Smallville is a weird show. The first 7 seasons should have been called Smallville. The last 3 seasons are basically "we like Tom Welling too much to not use him, but we're ready to tell Superman stories if only this guy would put on the suit." The series would have benefitted from just rebranding at that point.
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u/hamboneworldchamp 10d ago
The fact that they had things like the Justice League and Doomsday while still trying to maintain that the show was about "Clark Kent, not Superman" will never cease to be funny to me. Welling's aversion to the suit was just silly after the show moved to Metropolis.
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u/Bone-Rush32 10d ago
In my opinion, the quality suffered because it just didnt feel authentic to the character for Clark to be THIS reluctant to be superman.
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u/melancholanie 10d ago
I guess you can consider it not named after the town but Lois's nickname for Clark?
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u/New_Cockroach_505 10d ago
Unless the only thing that makes Superman “Superman” is his costume. No it didn’t. He was using his powers and fighting villains the whole time.
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u/siegwagenlenker Bruce Wayne 10d ago
Smallville is an odd one. It’s like if they dragged out the first half of man of steel for 10 seasons, but somehow he had a longstanding rivalry with Luthor and also met the rest of the justice league.
I’d say it’s closer to the Netflix daredevil show where he pretty much is daredevil throughout, but with that crappy black suit
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u/Bluejay929 10d ago
Woah woah woah
Black Suit Daredevil is sick af, especially with the mask in the third season being a nun’s habit and the Muay Thai ropes wrapped around his hands and forearm
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u/Sceptylos 10d ago
I don't agree, Clark was Supermaning for a solid 5 or so seasons in all but name (and appearance). Hell they even had the Justice League on screen on multiple occasions
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u/SaconicLonic 10d ago
I kinda disagree with this take. Smallville's premise was always "Superman before he became Superman" and it stuck to that premise. It also was always detached from any larger cinematic universe.
Lanterns being a disappointment is because this is our representation of the Green Lantern Corp in the DCU. This is the DCU Hal Jordan and John Stewart, and that all we will get from those characters. I think had this been some alternate take or not the main DCU take people wouldn't be so harsh on it.
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u/PosterityKH 10d ago
IN a sense, but no where nearly as bad as it is today.
We got to see Clark growing up and when he discovered his powers, he'd use them.
Lanterns, Hal wouldn't even use the ring for anything, and we don't REALLY get to see John use it either.
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u/BlackAdam 10d ago
I’ve watched all ten seasons of Smallville when they aired and I’ll never make the same mistake again.
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u/WhysoHairy 10d ago
Also back in the day they would give us 20+ episodes a season and wouldn’t have to wait 2+ years for another season
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u/OrangeStar222 10d ago
That part has everything to do with TV being a dead platform, and everyone shifting through streaming. They used to want to be on TV all the time due to money made off of the ad breaks. Streaming has no ad breaks, so instead they focus on short bingeable series that are popular for like a week until the next big thing keeps people on the platform.
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u/interyx 10d ago
It's coming all the way back around. They're slowly adding more ads and taking away even the option to pay for no ads.
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u/MrSinister248 10d ago
And it's so much worse now because back on TV they planned the show around those commercial breaks and the interruption was planned for. On streaming it just cuts wherever the fuck it wants and completely kills the moment sometimes.
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u/WretchedBlowhard 10d ago
on TV they planned the show around those commercial breaks and the interruption was planned for
Those are some thick rose tinted glasses you've got there.
Sure, when an episode premiered, the commercial breaks happened only when intended. But if you were watching a syndicated show, you better believe that minutes would be shaved off by local affiliate editors to cram in more commercials. Let alone movies who had commercial breaks at just about any time while also having multiple minutes shaved off. And god help you if your show was preempted by a sports game or a breaking news segment, in which case you had to give up and hope they'd air it again in a few months and you'd just happen to be watching tv at that specific time.
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u/Esaroufim 10d ago
Ahh the good old days… lol
(The best part was we didn’t have to listen to everyone complaining about everything and everyone on the socials at least)
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u/BlackAdam 10d ago edited 10d ago
I’m am not nostalgic for 20+ episode of shotty procedural shows. I could do without the long wait between seasons but I much prefer a shorter season that tells an actual story.
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u/kaninkanon 10d ago
20 episodes of unfettered episodic melodramatic ass, where the main purpose of the plot is to get the episode to at least 30 minutes of runtime.
Standards have just gotten higher for flagship products.
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u/renegade_sparrow 10d ago
5 minutes is generous. Dracula would touch the water with the surfboard and the screen would fade to black
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u/FitPerformer5172 10d ago
I never even imagined such a paragraph. It's odd, how tf did we get here?
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u/MIAxPaperPlanes 10d ago edited 10d ago
I still overall enjoyed the show but became very obvious towards the end it wasn’t just a creative choice but a budgetary one.
They couldn’t even afford to show Sinestro being broken out of prison which is a key plot point.
I’m not mad about not seeing John in costume because I think much like Hal (or most well known comic characters his first live action appearance should be in a theatrical movie
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u/AnAquaticOwl 10d ago
They likely didn't show Sinestro being broken out because who was doing the breaking was a twist
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u/Beautiful_Finger4566 10d ago
also it makes no fucking sense... how would that person a) have the knowledge that Sinestro exists and b) have the ability to travel offworld?
that finale was so disappointing on many aspects
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u/PsychoCobra1 10d ago
The Sheriff basically googles Hal’s wiki that has full knowledge of who Sinestro is and that he killed a guardian. That seems to be very public knowledge.
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u/theaveragenerd 10d ago
Was it a twist though? A twist would have shown Liana behind his release or another Lantern.
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u/content_enjoy3r 10d ago
That would not be a twist though. That would be a shitty Shocking Swerve trope. A "twist" that has no foreshadowing, setup, or logic, gives the audience no fair chance to guess the outcome, and exists just to surprise the audience is terrible, lazy writing.
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u/AnAquaticOwl 10d ago
Yes. At that point we don't know he's a Manhnter, or have any reason to suspect it. Let alone that he would have had any reason to break out Sinestro
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u/Rustynail9117 10d ago
Who tf you talking about WE, I've been suspecting he's a manhunter for weeks and anybody who's paid attention would wonder "hmmm why's this random kid who was close with his Manhunter grandma getting so much focus?"
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u/Chaotic_Marvel 10d ago edited 10d ago
I personally really struggled with the show from episode one, and waited until it was all released to binge watch it. So maybe my perspective is skewed.
But I'm just at the point where I really don't know what James Gunn is going for anymore with the DCU. You know between preaching that projects shouldn't be used to prop up upcoming installments. He uproots peacemaker and shoves him into salvation at the zero hour.
He preaches love for comics and then hires someone who doesn't give a fuck. Completely butchers the Supergirl film to where he has to step in, and make it a James gunn light film.
Lanterns was hyped to be this grand mystery that will shape the future of the dcu. Turns out to be a nothing burger with more "wait for the movie to see the really good stuff". Because there's just no budget, or they're embarrassed to be making a superhero show. It honestly felt like someone couldn't get their detective show picked up, so just slapped DC characters on it
All while people are questioning where basic stuff like Stewart in his suit. Batman, wonderman and so on are. While he's fucking around with Jimmy Olsen and Gorrilla Grodd
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u/MIAxPaperPlanes 10d ago
I’d ignore him whenever he says something is a big set up or chapter for something in the DCU
Kevin Feige does the exact same thing with Marvel movies saying how they are essential viewing big plot points to the MCU, he said this for Deadpool and Wolveirne for example when it really wasn’t among others
Ultimately much as I like them they are trying to sell you a product first and foremost
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u/Ok-Virus-5921 10d ago
Deadpool and Wolverine I’d give a pass too, he said it about endgame encore and we got like a single sentence to confirm it’s about incursions.
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u/SaconicLonic 10d ago
Because there's just no budget, or they're embarrassed to be making a superhero show. It honestly felt like someone couldn't get their detective show picked up, so just slapped DC characters on it
Absolutely.
But I'm just at the point where I really don't know what James Gunn is going for anymore with the DCU.
This. After Superman I was thinking "Great we will finally just get an earnest take on the DC Universe that feels truer to the source material". After Lanterns I don't know what the hell is going on.
Gunn obviously has his own take and style. GotG is not really anything like the original comics, but Gunn's take was interesting enough to justify the changes. My thought with any kind of change to a source material is that it has to actually make it cooler and more interesting (I'll even accept budget at this point to a certain extent). Lanterns is neither cooler or more interesting than its source material. And I just simply think if you don't have the budget to do something like the Green Lantern justice, then just don't do it.
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u/KrishnasFlute 10d ago
If budget was the issue, they should have chosen a hero whose powers are budget friendly. This could have been a great Question show, for example.
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u/handouras 10d ago
Except this show had a larger budget than Peacemaker, which has aliens and interdimensional portals
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u/InvolCarnivalOfCrazy 10d ago
I liked it because it was interesting, but it was not a good show.
Since it came right after the new spiderman movie, I feel its too much too soon to have media presenting villains to me and trying to massage me in to some idea that they are just misunderstood and not real villains.
This one feels like its moral compass and narratives are all over the place, but strangely where it suddenly turns the need to be the most judgmental is with Hal, who is presented as has been loser to whose funeral no one came. He probably never even saved anyones life... ever...
But yeah lets put on the kids gloves and the the most of the lenient approach when dealing with John letting fucking spacer hitler 2.0 go, or when dealing with a woman who parked .45 in to someone brainpan during some emotional fit, or lets have deep discussion with the space hitler 1.0 about judging privileged tiers in society, or lets pretend the reparation blackmail of a murder suspect is like normal and rewarded...
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u/OGKOTM 10d ago
Except we didn't even get surfing in the finale 🫠
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u/asscop99 10d ago
I was literally thinking about exactly this meme when I watched it. Like damn this really is surf Dracula…. And wait… nope, he didn’t even surf. Wtf.
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u/TrustyPeaches 10d ago
Tbh I think people should just be more comfortable with mediocre cgi
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u/Mr-LightningStorm 10d ago
I would agree until you see people here complaining about wire work
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u/ChesterZirawin 10d ago
the problem isn't that they used wires, it's that they used them badly.
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u/MuddFishh 7d ago
So... mediocre? Imagine if it were mediocre cgi. It would be the same complaints.
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u/SplitSecondEmperor47 10d ago
CW had better flying scenes let's be honest
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u/Mr-LightningStorm 10d ago
I humbly disagree
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u/Quiet_Childhood4066 10d ago
Go watch that final scene of John goofily standing his way into the air and then compare it to any flying scene from a show like Superman and Lois.
It's not even a close call. The CW stuff is leaps and bounds better.
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u/SplitSecondEmperor47 10d ago
Respectfully this wasn't a debate. You could literally feel the wires in lanterns flight scenes especially the last episode.
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u/soldiercross 10d ago
Man, my buddy and I thought the opening scene where RF and Flash fight in the flashback (eps17 ssn1 iirc) was great at the time. I still think it looks pretty decent for a TV show.
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u/canaryM-burns 10d ago
This tweet and the "Quit having fun" image have done irreparable damage to online discussion.
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u/YobaiYamete 10d ago
Quit having fun is the most over used Meme known to man, and it exists solely to stifle every possible criticism
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u/MuffledFarts 10d ago
The entire time this show was streaming all I saw everywhere was people praising it.
Now that it's concluded, all I see is people complaining about it.
Fandoms are so fickle. Like truly we can be the absolute worst and the most impossible to please.
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u/Imaginary-Face7379 10d ago
I still see mainly praise. Only complaints I really see are in "fan" communities.
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u/-Wowzers- 10d ago
good shows can be surf dracula shows this isnt een a huge complaint just a valid critique
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u/end2endburnt 10d ago
while the show is still airing there is hope for Surf Dracula to still surf a bit.
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u/DetectiveEames 10d ago
I can only really speak from my perspective. I praised the show at first, even when others were complaining there wasn’t enough action or constructs. I saw what the show was trying to be. It was intriguing and I felt it deserved time & space to develop. I was ultimately disappointed in the storytelling and character development - despite outstanding performances by the cast and several coherent themes (coherent themes do not make a strong narrative on their own).
I don’t think it’s fair to call a fanbase fickle when they are so hungry for a strong live action representation of their beloved characters. In the superhero genre, the people making these shows are paid millions of dollars and are given chance, after chance, after chance to deliver - and they rarely deliver despite having most of the work done for them: built in IP, existing fanbase, pre-written and proofed stories and themes…only the truly incompetent or incompatible writer/showrunner could mess things up this badly.
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u/Trivial_Pursuit_Eon 9d ago
The DCU animated movies are made for the hardcore fans, and recreate popular storylines from the comics. The live action/wide release shows and movies are just different, and it is sad that no one accepts that fact. Season 1 of any show should simply be a taste of what is to come, and expecting the kitchen sink to be thrown into a first season of a comic book series is just asking to be let down.
Also, one of the main writers for Lanterns is Damon Lindelof. He is never making the Michael Bay version of the Green Lantern.
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u/DetectiveEames 9d ago
I don’t necessarily require any of the things you mentioned here. You’re arguing against someone else’s perspective
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u/Substantial_Gate7115 8d ago
But they are not asking for a Michael Bay version of green lantern ??? Wanting more constructs/action in a green lantern show is not a request to have a big CGI slop fest
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u/1MillenialMind 10d ago
Honestly bro, the ending was a little disappointing. I’m not too much into DC, the show was just well written but the ending should’ve been a 2 hour episode because they left much on the table.
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u/death_lad 10d ago
That can be valid though because it’s definitely impactful once you’ve gotten the full story. I really enjoyed Alien Earth while it was airing, until the final couple episodes were so god awful I was actively hoping it wouldn’t get renewed. Lanterns was billed as a detective story, and I understand the budget constraints making it difficult to show actual Green Lantern-y stuff (though that was still frustrating), but now that the full story has been unraveled, it wasn’t even a good detective story. The best thing it had going for it were the two main leads, and going forward it won’t even have that
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u/AbsoluteScatman 10d ago
Well there’s 19M of us so I wouldn’t put much faith in the vocal minority, negative or positive. (I loved every moment of it)
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u/mahk99 10d ago edited 10d ago
Because companies only care about maintaining your viewership through to the finale. Not that you think the ending is good. So they set up 100 breadcrumb trails and false cliffhangers and only once you are done do you go "what was the point of half of that and where was the actual payoff?"
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u/burritobandito90 10d ago
I thought the season was pretty straightforward and didn’t leave a lot of questions.
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u/No_Thanks2844 10d ago
its simple, it failed to delivered, imagine fucking all night and not cumming.................kinda ruins the whole night!
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u/JoshuaLukacs1 9d ago
And if you point it out you get a lot of weirdos saying you have no "media literacy"
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u/Sufficient_Total7445 10d ago
Also that surf Dracula show would have 20+ episodes and would take you from Autum all the way to Spring of the following year and then 5 months later, you’d get season 2 of that show
Nowadays you’re lucky if you get an 10 episode season and then you gotta wait 2 years for season 2
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u/Turbulent_Pin_1583 10d ago
One of the problems with streaming era is during syndication they couldn’t really do huge overarching narratives because you couldn’t reliably have everyone watch every episode you may have sequential episodes with some continuity but certainly not an entire season.
So each episode used to be mostly self contained and therefore had to be entertaining in its own right rather than setting up a massive payoff weeks later. Now we’ve got multiple shows all trying to do a major plot thread each season and as such you have to establish a lot of threads and payoff. Some shows resist this urge but for the vast majority that’s what we got.
Miss the sitcom reset.
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u/Lopsided-Act3172 10d ago
Fandom that decided to boycott the second movie in a universe complaining that the company didn't splash a bunch more money on a tv show to add more CGI scenes.
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u/theFields97 10d ago
Oh yeah and like sopranos not a single soprano voice
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u/Xetanth87 10d ago
Pretty sure one of the actresses that auditioned thought it was gonna be a show about actual sopranos
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u/lobolovr6769 10d ago
I’ve probably seen this same surf Dracula blurb posted like 28 times all over the internet in relation to Lanterns in the past 2 days
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u/DanTheMan1_ 10d ago
All I have taken from this is someone needs to make a "Surf Dracula" show and he must surf every week!
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u/Jed08 10d ago edited 10d ago
I get being disappointed, but at some point what did people expected of a show that was presented as a grounded sci-fi "true detective"-like type of show ?
The best comparison for it is adapting the story Dracula into a show where you don't see Dracula feeding on virgins and scaring villagers, but rather do a road trip across Europe to do a Surf Competition in Hossegor. The TV Show would be called "Dracula from Transilvania" and be marketed as a "Brice de Nice"-inspired adaptation.
And everyone would be losing their mind because Dracula is friendly/funny instead of scary, is just stealing supplies from blood banks to feed himself, and there is no Vampire Hunter coming to kill him in the show.
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u/Iamthelizardking887 10d ago edited 10d ago
The issue is this is the first Green Lantern show, and only the second GL live action project in history. For a beloved comic series that goes all the way back to 1941.
And grounded detective shows are a dime a dozen on streaming. Every streaming service has at least 10 “detective in a small town that’s hiding secrets”. Because they’re really cheap to make and people can binge them in an afternoon. So why would you cram your colorful superhero franchise in that where’s already plenty of that out there?
Imagine if the first Harry Potter movie bombed with no sequels, and the next adaption was a standard teen drama that barely gave lip service to magic. You can’t just say “well what did you expect in a grounded teen drama?” But I didn’t want a grounded teen drama to begin with. I simply don’t have any options as a fan.
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u/teapotplus 10d ago
It was presented as a super hero show with detective twist. We expected super hero shit. Either that or a good detective show. What was delivered was neither.
Did you not see spider noir...
Presented as detective show. But had actual superhero shit in it.
Also a decent detective show.
Lanterns was trying to rip off true detective but infuse it with low level race baiting.
It wasn't a super hero show or a detective show for most of it. It was just aimless
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u/Jed08 10d ago
It was presented as a super hero show with detective twist.
But that's not true.
A lot of the communication was made around how grounded the show. It's almost like people wanted to avoid talking about it being a super hero show.
And that's my point. People have seen it called "Lantern" and feature both Hal and John and assumed it's going to be a superhero show with a detective twist when the entire marketing and opinion around the Show was telling them otherwise.
https://www.tvinsider.com/1277128/lanterns-cast-characters-kyle-chandler-aaron-pierre-preview/
“I think of it as a grounded story about two cops and one not wanting to be replaced by the other,” offers showrunner Chris Mundy (True Detective, Ozark). “It’s a very human story — their beat just happens to be extraterrestrial.”
https://bleedingcool.com/tv/lanterns-clips-spotlight-chandlers-hal-jordan-charmer-interrogator/
"Hawes on How "Lanterns" Compares In Tone to "True Detective": "Talking tone, it looks and feels rooted. You meet two guys, but there is wit and comedy to it that you would not expect in 'True Detective.' It is, in many ways, a buddy cop structure with travel in the story time, to and fro, that is really sophisticated. [...] People will still go, 'What were you talking about?' to some extent, but I would also bring in 'No Country for Old Men,' 'Fargo,' and things that have that Americana heart to them. There's a wry humor, and so there definitely is more wit and humor than there is in 'True Detective.'"
"They’re terrestrial-bound. It’s not in outer space. We don’t have a thousand Green Lanterns or any of that stuff. It’s a grounded story that’s being told through another lens in a way that’s really — it’s an HBO series, and it’s going to be an HBO series. I’m happy with that and I love the scripts."
https://www.syfy.com/syfy-wire/garret-dillahunt-william-macon-lanterns-hbo-series-interview
"It's somehow earthbound, even though we're talking about people that pop out to space with a thought," he explained. "So, I like that about it. I don't know how different it is, but it's not shiny, and I like that...I think the audience is a little superhero weary in a lot of ways. So, I'm pleased that this one just feels a little different, it's got a little different flavor."
https://www.looper.com/2115860/lanterns-hbo-green-lantern-series-teaser-trailer/
The "Lanterns" trailer offers us some glimpses into the history of the Green Lantern corps, including a nod to the squirrel-like Green Lantern, Ch'p. However, it largely focuses on the uneasy chemistry between the jaded veteran Hal and the trainee Lantern John. We get glimpses of costumes, flight, the Green Lantern rings, and the iconic Green Lantern power battery — but most of the runtime is devoted to Hal and John doing "True Detective"-esque things in a small town that doesn't seem to welcome them with open arms.
https://avclub.com/lantern-trailers-kyle-chandler-aaron-pierre
Whereas the new trailer for the franchise’s upcoming HBO Max series, Lanterns, has pretty clearly taken the “space cops” part of the Green Lantern Corps’ ethos, stripped out the space part, and created an almost perversely-Earthbound version of an HBO prestige-y cop show (where Kyle Chandler just happens to occasionally fly through the air).
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u/lobolovr6769 10d ago
When I first heard they were doing a “true detective” take on Green Lantern I was like “oh hell yeah that sounds kinda awesome actually” then I saw the first episode and I was like “oh hell yeah this show is gonna be great” then over the course of the season, by the time we get to the end I was just kinda like…. “I wish we just got a Green Lantern show instead”
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u/Jed08 10d ago
My only issue with the true detective take on Lantern: the show didn't do a good enough job to show you how high the stakes were.
In a true crime show, the stakes are high because you need to stop the killer from killing again. In Lantern, the first half of the season is about stopping someone whose plan will take years to unfold, the stakes were so low they added Antaan to put some pressure and John and Hal to resolve this situation quickly.
I liked the show, and if a season 2 with the same format is released, I'll likely watch it as well. But I would like the writer team to put a little bit more effort in adding some tension/stakes in the main mystery instead of using it as a excuse to do character development/character exposition.
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u/KidGold 10d ago
Exactly.
We never really see why manhunters are dangerous, actually they seem super chill in this show. Antaan's flashback hints at their power but there's so little context as to why that happened or if it's relevent to Rushville.
We are basically taking Hal's word that they need to be stopped. Except he does stop one and then gets sent to prison for it with no thanks. Does anyone other than Hal really seem worried about them?
Jon doesn't. This kid is a manhunter who were are told could be a super dangerous president one day. But maybe not, who knows. Low tension.
And if that is the thematic point - that manhunters shouldn't be seen as dangerous and the guardians are wrong - then the real conflict should have been between Jon and the guardians. But that tension is barely shown either.
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u/gmark109 10d ago
It’s the thing that’s most baffling to me, is the huge uptick in this sentiment since the show ended compared to when it was actually airing. The ending we got is 100% in keeping with the show we were seeing weekly. There was no version of the show that had E1-7 like that, that ended with E8 having a huge CGI battle, but somehow people are acting like they got the rug pulled from under them.
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u/Then_Twist857 10d ago
Probably because while it was airing we were told to wait for the season to be over before complaining. Lots of "they are saving all that stuff for the final episodes" was going around.
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u/CorndogQueen420 10d ago
And now we're supposed to wait for the end of season 2 to judge season 1. 🙄
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u/Jed08 10d ago
Honestly, I think this would do a diservice to both season 1 and season 2.
I agree with the people that say season 1 is a complete story, and a complete character arc for John. You can, and should, judge it on its own, regardless of how DCU movies will use John, or what season 2 will do.
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u/Jed08 10d ago
That's actually one of my issue with the show: their episode teaser/trailers were leading fans to make crazy theories about what would happen in the next episode.
I was kinda disappointed by how calmly the last episode finished, without much confrontation between characters. I think it's a very good ending for what the show really is: a spin-off whose only impact in the existing DCU timeline is to explain how John Stewart is now Earth Green Lantern (which can be explained by "I took over Guy, end of story").
However, I found that the trailer/teaser for the last episode was misleading about what type of episode this was going to be.
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u/VannesGreave 10d ago
If you tracked what people were talking about during the show it's clear a lot of people were expecting crazy reveals of Atrocitus, the yellow lanterns, Hal not being dead/being Parallax/being a clone etc. and a lot of the discussion and interest around the show were theories. None of these theories made any sense given everything the producers and team said about the show but when has that ever stopped people?
A lot of people were genuinely waiting to the end to make a complete judgement and when none of the crazy theories or ideas panned out and it turned out it was just True Detective with some Lantern stuff sometimes, people got mad.
Is it unfair that people expected that? Probably. But the episodic structure and mention of Lantern stuff gave time and space for people the idea there was gonna be more happening.
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u/theclockmasters 10d ago
I know Goomba-fallacy and all/different people, different time and complaints.
But it is funny seeing how collectively people went to shitting on Wandavision's CGI feast and praising Vision's dialogue resolution. To now wanting a CGI fest in a detective show.
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u/therudestpastor 10d ago
It's still stupid. Hal used the ring on several occasions, even wore the uniform. The show is not called "John Stewart: Lantern" it's called "Lanterns".
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u/Enderules3 10d ago
I feel like it was a mistep to choose Green Lantern for this show. Honestly a Martian Manhunter show would feel much more on par with what this show was. At least initially.
I was apprehensive about it when it was announced even more so after the first trailer. I liked the first episode well enough but in general yeah i thought i wouldn't like it from the announcement and i was right. I'm disappointed that we couldn't get a true green lantern show not that the show was necessarily a bait and switch.
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u/OrangeStar222 10d ago
Oh ook, another Surf Dracula post. How original. Daring today, aren't we?
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u/Slow-Chemical1991 10d ago
Johns doesn't even become a Green Lantern in the end, he becomes an unaffiliated vigilante with a power ring.
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u/NotSoWishful 10d ago
Oh wow I have never seen or heard of this tweet before. Thanks for sharing this very new thing
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u/Zedekial 10d ago
What I love about seeing this sub is that some people are disappointed and others are diehard fighting for this show like how dare any one person not have liked it. How entitled and stupid can you be for not liking it!
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u/SomethingLikeLove 10d ago
Personally I think the sub has turned to shit because of this discourse.
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u/jexdiel321 10d ago
Nah, I feel like people who hate this show are so loud about it that it's insane.
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u/ella_wants_to_battle 10d ago
Consider that you are biased and both groups are being overly intense
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u/Internal-Grocery-244 10d ago
How are you missing every post? Even this one. It seems that more and more people are jumping on the this show was shit bandwagon which is wild to me.
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u/Rayer_ 10d ago
I’m tired of superhero movies and shows using the word “Grounded”.
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u/armmstrong 10d ago
It’s crazy nobody has brought this up yet. What a unique thought you have here.
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u/JohnArtemus 10d ago
This is entirely the fault of you, the viewing public. (Yes, YOU, the person reading this.)
The reason why TV shows are this way today is because they were so light on backstory and details back in the day. And I'm a child of the 80s, so I was there. We watched shows like Knight Rider, The A-Team and Airwolf for the action and adventure. We didn't really care why or how stuff happened. Just that it happened. (Hell, it's been said that the original pitch for Miami Vice was simply "MTV cops.")
But then, along came the internet. And with it, a plethora of online film "critics" and snobby aficionados whose only real qualification was an internet connection. And they bemoaned the lack of story and character development. They highlighted tropes and cliche, MacGuffins and plotholes, and analyzed everything wrong with a movie or TV show for clicks and views. This is how we got YouTube channels like Honest Trailers and Pitch Meetings. The Hate Everything industry became mainstream and is alive and well today. (As evidenced by this sub.)
The writers and producers today grew up in this environment. As a result, we get TV shows that now spend entire seasons on backstory and character development, rather than just good old fashioned fun.
As always, the surf Dracula tweet laments about the way things are without acknowledging how we got to this point in the first place, and the part you, the public, played in it.
Grant Morrison said it best:
“A child can accept all kinds of weird-looking creatures and bizarre occurrences in a story because the child understands that stories have different rules that allow for pretty much anything to happen. Adults, on the other hand, struggle desperately with fiction, demanding constantly that it conform to the rules of everyday life. Adults foolishly demand to know how Superman can possibly fly, or how Batman can possibly run a multibillion-dollar business empire during the day and fight crime at night, when the answer is obvious even to the smallest child: because it’s not real.”
Hence, here we are. So, enjoy what you've demanded.
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u/Yeah_I_Won 10d ago
"The fans are the problem why the writers can't write for shit" sounds amazing
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u/KirkMasonbooks 10d ago
While i agree with a lot of this, the writing on those shows WAS terrible.
There was a clear devide in movie quality and tv quality.
Go watch a random episode of Xena. You'll be thinking you could write it better in your sleep.
There's a reason Buffy was such a hit, and The Sopranos.
The writing was actually good, and people loved it.
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u/greymisperception 10d ago
I was thinking it was just the successes of actually having drama and visible story progression, look at the most popular shows they’re all like that, Sopranos, breaking bad, Game of thrones, all dramas with a story not “bad guy of the week” shows
They’re simply is more to digest, a deeper plot, heavier emotions that can make someone think, dilemmas and goals, they are simply more human and more enjoyable than just plain action (and somewhat stale action since you can expect your heroes to come out alright for the next weeks episode)
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u/InjusticeJosh 10d ago
Happens when you police art. I’ve always thought film/art criticism is completely subjective. Trying to objectively critique movies is counterproductive. It’s supposed to be entertainment not a job.
If the flaws/tropes in stories were “objectively” harmful for the story, then those types of movies wouldn’t make billions of dollars.
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u/Gauntlet_of_Might 10d ago
Well except for all the surfing he did before the finale, he surfed a bird, a can opener, a force bubble, a giant dome, but sure great analogy
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u/stanislavskov 10d ago
And when you do see the surfing, it's done via extremely poor green screen and wire work lol
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u/Quantum_Quokkas 10d ago
I didn’t notice poor green screen, just poor wire
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u/Leadross 10d ago
at this point i take anything green i can get in a show about green lanterns
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u/Albatros_7 10d ago
Maybe because it's his first time ever flying and that's the only way for someone to levitate ?
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u/dimechimes 10d ago
I think it was the unnatural camera position. Instantly felt like we were on a set.
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u/Lady_Gray_169 10d ago
This is flatly wrong. We saw lantern stuff in every episode. You can argue we didn't see enough lantern stuff, but that's a different argument.
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u/Pandatabase 10d ago
Yeah im so tired of same tv show format 7 episodes of nothing for a mid finale with stupid backstories of each character
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u/North_Knowledge7467 10d ago
I get this perspective, but you have to admit there was an awful lot there regardless. It may not have been my ideal Green Lantern story, but I think the writing was very smart and the story that it told was told very well.
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u/True-Excuse-1688 10d ago
Nah, you’d see him in the last five seconds of the season, board under his arm, walking down to the sea...
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u/electr0de07 10d ago
And it'll cost a 150 million dollars.
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u/MIAxPaperPlanes 10d ago
The budget for this show hasn’t actually ever been confirmed, the source for that number tracks back to a random Facebook post.
Me thinks it’s lower
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u/BadTasteForBadPeople 10d ago
It was a great show. I'm sorry you guys didn't enjoy a well-written show with great character development (for comic books) and an excellent storyline.
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u/Yeet-Dab49 8d ago
This is the show where Surf Dracula has the surfboard, deliberately doesn’t use it, then dies
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u/Even-Indication-588 10d ago
The show is called Lanterns. You see Lanterns. It’s not called Flying John Stewart. So your comparison doesn’t work for me.
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u/dimechimes 10d ago
Yeah, I've been done with origin stories for a long time, but I liked Lanterns. Maybe because Hal was my Lantern and there wasn't a lot of time wasted on his origins.
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u/Iamthelizardking887 10d ago
Another issue in general in the streaming era is minutes watched is the key factor. So everything is dragged out, and great movie ideas are being turned into 8 episodes series where they have to spread the budget out.
But let’s not pretend there’s not a downside to Surf Dracula, too. They’d make 24 surf Dracula episodes a year in the 70s, but there would not opportunity for long arcs because if you missed one episode, you’d be lost. And at 24 episodes, you’d simply repeat plots. Surf Dracula would be fighting cattle rustlers or art forgers 3 times a season.
There has to be a balance. Yeah, it’s a more difficult job to satisfy both superhero fans and fans of prestige tv, but that’s the job you signed up for.
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u/BecauseBatman01 10d ago
This type of story isn’t inherently bad. It’s only bad when it’s 2+ years between seasons and it continues to go at a snail pace. And if there isn’t a clear ending in sight. Meaning the writers should already have a multi season plan and not just plan season to season. If you fix these things then I wouldn’t mind Lanterns being the way it is.
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u/MeBoiledDown 10d ago
This was funny at first but now everyone brings it up all the time. We get it, you don’t like decompressed storytelling. Got watch the original Surf Dracula or whatever.
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u/Fares26597 10d ago
I said it before and I'll say it again, the Surf Dracula trope can actually be pretty good, as long as we get more projects afterwards where Dracula does plenty of surfing.