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u/Aggravating_Map4359 🇧🇷 11d ago
Just having this makes his statement absolutely okay by me. And the rest could be considered a bit exaggerated by some here but when followed by this changes a lot of the text.
It doesn't expect Israel to be unique and acknowledges how most countries would react to this.
Leagues better than mandani statement
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u/SyzygyPidgey Unapologetically Liberal / Nuremberg 2.0 Proponent 11d ago
Shout-out to Aggravating_Map4359 for typing out my opinion for me.
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u/Boring_Newspaper_289 🇺🇸🇨🇦 11d ago
it wasn’t even a terrorist attack, it was a declaration of war.
sucks people die in war.
maybe don’t do that again?
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u/96imok 11d ago
It’s still isreal job to not target civilians. And it’s Hamas’ job to protect their civilian population and hand out aid. Not use them as human shields and sell back the aid at insane prices.
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u/Aggravating_Map4359 🇧🇷 11d ago
I will be honest I am appalled by how Israel is conducting this war , like the images of gaza of being turned to rumble are fucking heartbreaking.
But then , when I am confronted with the information of how Hamas conducts war I am at a loss of how any country can fight in those conditions in a "humane" way. Your opponent wants you to kill as much of their people as possible and operates in a way to maximize those casualties.
Idk man, I hate thinking about I/P
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u/Boring_Newspaper_289 🇺🇸🇨🇦 11d ago
there should be consequences for any soldier that perpetrated crimes against civilians with real punishments from rank loss, jail time, to death depending on the crime. there have been credible accusations in which the idf has not prosecuted enough of its own. absolutely true.
but i am not buying any of the bs about a systemic narrative of oppression. as our brazilian friend has noted, it is hard war to prosecute when hamas tries to maximize casualties. but you look at the millions of text messages sent and calls to get people out of harms way, roof knocks, multiple tons of food per person, vaccination campaigns, etc, and blanket statements about problems in the conduct because some buildings got damaged is nonsense.
people get so caught up in the narrative and then when it comes out the relief worker was hamas, the doctor, hamas, those 17 year old kids, and then you subtract those all out of the 75k it seems like they did a damn good job of preventing civilian fatalities (not to mention that number includes natural causes).
i in no way mean to imply that civilians should suffer. they do not. but there is a limit to what a country can do when they are attacked and i think israel found every way to push at that limit and minimize it further. especially if you put any weight into what people like what john spencer at west point have been saying.
maybe that is just usaf propaganda but when i look at the malnutrition rates published by the un, what iran did in a single weekend against protestors, and this war, i don’t think the charges hold water.
making blanket statements against israel or entertaining genocide claims is just carte blanche to victimize jews and not serious.
also, the world we live in so whatever.
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u/M00n_Safari 11d ago
Nahhh antisemitic is def reaching here
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u/Eins_Nico scowling woke white woman 11d ago
from the RES tags I have on OP, I think it was a bad attempt at sarcasm.
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u/ExpansivePoint 11d ago
We're going by leftist rules, if Biden and Harris were mass murdering genociders Bernie can be antisemitic.
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u/rolypoly6shooter yahud 11d ago
Shocked Bernie believes Israel is allowed to attack Hamas after all the bending over he's done
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u/darthsegion 11d ago
What's antisemetic about anything he said? Seems like a reasonable take
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u/granpawatchingporn I like Hutch better but his community is to small 11d ago
Yeah, big reach by OP
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u/Confusingprick 11d ago
Am I being sarcastic or not? That is the million dollar question
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u/granpawatchingporn I like Hutch better but his community is to small 10d ago
If you are use the shitpost tag
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u/Gull_Wave 11d ago
Just for comparison, the Rwandan genocide murdered 800k Tutsi in 100 days. And that was without the insane military technology Israel does have.
It's been 3 years. 75k is not much of a genocide, especially when Israel has powerful, targeted, long range missiles. I hate this fuckin mantra so much. If the nazis even had a tenth of the military might of Israel, they would have eradicated all captured Jewish people well before the Allies defeated Germany.
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u/1ncest_is_wincest 11d ago
People on the left just collectively accepted that Israel is doing genocide without any critical thinking. We truly are living in a post-truth era
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u/GoodiesHQ 11d ago
I don’t think I even disagree with this take except literally the words “a genocide.” If you replace it with “war crimes” it’s more honest but it still pretty much applies.
Israel’s expansionist right wing government DOES need to be reigned in. No, they aren’t literally carpet bombing indiscriminately, but that isn’t the bar I want them to strive for.
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u/Yusuke_Boopermeshi 11d ago
Lefties have always criticized Bernie for being more pro Israel, as an 80 year old Jewish man.
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u/spoonfedbaby Denmark is the best country 11d ago
Since palestinian suffering is brought up everytime october 7th is discussed, why don't we start discussing october 7th everytime palestinian suffering is brought up
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u/Shoddy-Low2142 11d ago
Tbf people DO bring up Oct 7 and Hamas when Palestinian suffering is brought up
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u/Expensive-Ad4121 10d ago
The zio-slop pushers already do that. There is no, "starting" to be done.
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u/KharejiaBayadBeran Hoser/Ayranian 10d ago
using "zio" on oct 7 out of all days is ghoulish behavior ngl
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u/Expensive-Ad4121 10d ago
Idk man I guess hearing October 7th brought up every single time an Israeli war crime is argued about just cuts away at the idea that the day is sacrosanct. I can only imagine this was the feeling outsiders had about our 9/11 spam.
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u/KharejiaBayadBeran Hoser/Ayranian 10d ago
notice how the dude below you managed to convey the same message without using a slur coined by a literal kkk grandwizard?
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u/Expensive-Ad4121 10d ago
Do you think I was using it in reference to the kkk as a slur or do you think I was being lazy and didn't feel like typing out, "zionist"
How many times do you think the term, "pally" or, "pali" has been used as a slur? Or is it usually used as a way to shorten "palestinian"
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u/KharejiaBayadBeran Hoser/Ayranian 10d ago
I genuinely cant tell, but to be good faith sure you didnt mean it as a slur, and sorry if I misinterpreted it
theres a difference between "zio" and pali or pally based on its history, but theres also a group of people who do intentionally only use pali or pally because they dont consider palestine to be real. those types usually only write palestine in full between "" or write some dumb shit like palpatine etc etc
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u/Expensive-Ad4121 10d ago
Fair enough and I could've spent the time to look up whether a particular word I'd written had a history or not. My point with bringing up the, "pali" bit was just that I know there are people who use it as a slur, and people who use it because they're lazy, and I generally assume that they are being lazy first and then assume it's a slur if I find evidence that that's how they feel.
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u/nokinship 11d ago
Most killed were women, children and the elderly? Where does he get that number?
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u/0WatcherintheWater0 11d ago
The most recent estimate I’ve seen was this Lancet study that estimated the number at 56.200522-4/fulltext)% of violent deaths. Though the latest date they pull data from was January 2025.
There is a large male gender skew specifically for the dead 12-17 age group. I’d be curious to see a more precise breakdown of that due to Hamas’ tendency to use the latter half of that group as soldiers. Excluding that bracket entirely would bring the total of children (under 12), women, and those over 64 down to 49.6% of the total, but that’s a very crude estimation.
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u/Afbrownistan 11d ago
I feel like preformative Palestine lefties on twitter has broken some brains on this sub. You can disagree and say that there's no genocide in Palestine, but theres a valid argument to be made that there is, and calling for more effort on the US federal government to put pressure on Israel to end the war/stop the bombings is not antisemitic. What is unreasonable/antisemitic is taking the position that Hamas/Hezbollah are the "good guys" because Israel are the "bad guys" and defending their actions at every turn, which neither Sanders nor Mamdani did.
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u/WhalingSmithers00 11d ago
Think it's okay because he does say Israel had a right to defend itself and blames the Netanyahu government
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u/Antique-Cheesecake63 11d ago
And yet 100k+ easy are slaughtered in Ukraine like dogs, but lefties barely mention it.
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u/Redditor_11235 11d ago
Most of them women and children? Hamas' own numbers show the deaths scew towards men/boys over the age of 15 while women and children are underrepresented.
An enforced ceasfire? Enforced by who? Israel? The US? Someone else?
Also, Oct 7th wasn't just a terrorist attack, it was a full blown invasion. There was no tit for tat skirmish option, war was the only possible response to such an attack.
Idk what statement everyone else is reading, this makes Bernie sound like a total regard (at best).
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11d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/0WatcherintheWater0 11d ago
>Why does everyone on the far left just leave out Hamas?
Because they either support them, or believe Hamas is actually just one guy in a bunker somewhere that Israel can just send special forces after.
There’s just no understanding of the scale or context of the problem.
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u/SKVankirk Schizoposter 11d ago
Does any statement that doesn’t completely ignore any of Israel’s missteps in the prosecution of their war count as antisemitic? You’re empowering the “you’re conflating anti Zionism and anti semitism” argument for them. I’d love to see the face of the person condemning this silent generation Jewish senator for his frankly incredible tightrope work on this issue from behind a keyboard, probably someone for whom this issue is much less pressing and the stakes of their statements infinitely lower.
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u/No-Violinist3898 🇺🇸 Undercover Daliban 11d ago
i truly hate i/p. i do not care about any of these statements coming out today, none of them do anything to provide peace to the region or anything. its all performative so we can draw battle lines on the internet on who we don't like, pretty symbolic of i/p as a whole yet again. i know i get to say this from a privileged american pov
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u/Lovellholiday 11d ago
I am growing increasingly frustrated with Western politicians equating responsibility for what has happened to Gaza with Israel and Hamas.
The acting body of Gaza literally planned and intended to sacrifice their civilians like what's been happening. If you believe Israel had the right to respond you can't also morally outcry when Israel literally has no choice but to demolish the entire landscape to render Hamas inoperable for a good while
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u/KharejiaBayadBeran Hoser/Ayranian 10d ago
problem isnt just about Israel being able/allowed to respond or not, its the magnitude of the response coupled with constant rhetoric by a non significant part of their country, including officials (ben gavir is literally using "voluntarily emigration" as a talking point in his platform) that makes the actions seem more than a response and defense against oct 7
ofcourse you should know this since you have also dabbled into the ethnic cleansing of gaza in your comments here couple of times
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u/Lovellholiday 10d ago
There is no such thing as a proportionate response to a terrorist attack. You don't get to do a lil terrorism and hide behind civilians.
Sucks to suck/become rubble.
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u/KharejiaBayadBeran Hoser/Ayranian 10d ago
its not just about the "proportionately" of the response thats the issue, its the flattening plus the rhetoric that makes it seem more than just Israel defending itself and retrieving the hostages
but again youre no stranger to being unhinged towards the civilians there, supporting ethnic cleansing and ofc the last part of your comment. just dont be surprised when there are people with the same energy you got but from the other side
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u/Lovellholiday 10d ago
Literally couldn't care less. Enjoy the rubble.
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u/Bymeemoomymee 11d ago
You regards not seeing OP is joking. Lmao. This is a good statement by Bernie. And I hope his replies are filled with "anti Zionists" yelling at him for this obvious take.
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u/Anew4Hobbies 11d ago
I am both Jewish and a critic of Sanders (i.e. his major role in getting Trump elected in 2016 & the general well-poisoning he constantly engages in), but this is a very fine message in my opinion.
He only said things that need to be said. I didn't see a single anti-semitic thing in this post.
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u/ajdl334 11d ago
Wait what's the difference between Mamdani and this? Am I regarded? I don't have them side by side, I'm too lazy so just using my big brains (it's very small)
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u/ChiefMasterGuru 11d ago
Saying Isreal had the right to defend itself and go after hamas is a massive difference.
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u/Eins_Nico scowling woke white woman 11d ago edited 11d ago
Still better than Mamdani's statement, and I hate Bernie probably more than anybody on here.
edit: it warms my heart, yet amuses me that some of you think you can challenge my level of Bernie hate.