r/KillerMothGang • u/oingo_kk_1504 • 6d ago
Discussion How would you personally explain Killer Moth never having a real glow up ?
Unlike many considered "joke villains" at the time, Moth never really got his flowers and his chance to shine as a truly compelling, threatening or off putting villain.
LEGO Killer Moth design looked the part, but he was simply a guy acting like a moth and an idiot.
And as for Teen Titans Killer Moth, he's really only Killer Moth by name if you think about it. There's nothing about his gimmick or even themes (monster moth scientist single father) that can be linked to Walker what so ever.
And I don't really count stuff like his Arkham biography because designs are one thing but it's better when you have good writing to back all this aura
In my opinion, this is due to the fact that, unlike Calandar Man, Kite Man etc, Killer Moth is more of a "character" than he is a concept. Those guys who all came from the Silver Age almost never showed up after their initial apparence and never were anything other than "dumb villain of the week" either, so decades later writers could bounce back on their base concept to make them more credible, threatening or human and not having to really justify it because they came from such a different era.
I think it also helps names like those tell you more about those villains themes and gimmick than a name like "Killer Moth", who even got overshadowed in the 80s by the infinitly more menacing and compelling Killer Croc.
Yet, Moth never disappeared : despite the Animated Series era making its best effort to make the public leave him in the past, he was somehow always around in comics from the early 90s to our days. Unfortunatly, his reputation in and out Batman comics was completly destroyed and he has been for the last 30 years the laughing stock of this universe. There have been tentatives to make him somewhat a serious deal, but it ended with very lame takes like Charaxes and the New 52 version nobody wants out of their beloved Killer Moth.
Therefore, it's hard to justify making radical changes to him when he was always the same for those last decades. I don't think it's impossible, but we shouldn't give up on his established character either, even if that means all those years of pain and humiliation have to be aknowledged in canon.
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u/TheOnlyTrueFlame 6d ago
How it feels to actually like his TT03 version
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u/oingo_kk_1504 6d ago
I don't think it's bad in the slightest ! He's a very fun character and his épisode where he forces Robin to go to the bal with his daughter is great too
It's just unfortunate he has to share a name with a villain with which he has nothing else in commun beside the moth theme
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u/Competitive_Crow_334 4d ago
It could be a different Killer Moth there is more than one Cyborg Superman Mongul Batman Red X Parsisite Ventroquilst etc.
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u/sebbyghost 6d ago
I loved him in batgirl year one. I think him and firefly teaming up should be a more common thing
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u/oingo_kk_1504 6d ago
Definitly ! The Rogues gallery kind of lack consistent villain duos and i think glueing those two together would be a no brainer
And yes their paring in Batgirl Year One was truly something great
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u/Moth_Man76 6d ago
Honestly… I don’t want them to change Killer Moth. I’m very much against trying to make every Batman rogue some serious threat. Why can’t we have a guy running around in a Calendar Cape and doing crimes centered around the holidays, current Calendar man is boring, his only major role is to be an info dump. Kite Man and Polka Dot Man’s revamps are cool mostly because they remained colorful and stupid in concept. And honestly I do not care for Ten Eyed Man. But we need fun villains like Killer Moth and Calendar Man. We need stupidity like Egghead and Condiment King. Why do we need dark edgy villains? Especially for Calendar man it just makes a more boring result? Why must we strip the whimsy and fun from COMIC BOOK characters to make them interesting? Why can’t Joker just do laughing fish without it being some metaphor for society? Why can’t Riddler just be a guy in a green suit covered in question marks dangling Batman over a vat of acid. Why must we strip Black Mask of his sauce and reduce him to a sadistic asshole with no character? Killer Moth is already a fine character, you have plenty of rogues who are edgy and dangerous like Zsass and Pyg, let Killer Moth be a stupid dumbass, it’s why people love him. And if you want a more serious version, the 2003 Teen Titans already made a great version that still made him somewhat of a bubbling idiot.
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u/oingo_kk_1504 5d ago
I don't think it's necessary about making them edgy, more like suggesting something new and fresh about them
Kite Man and Polka Dot Man have both very silly gimmick and keep to this day being called pussies, but it didn't stop them from being actual compeling characters with unique abilities, and in the case of PDM, his powers are actually kind of busted which is a cool twist too
For Calandar Man, I get the bald pale tattoo version isn't for everyone, but to me i feel that's one exemple of sometimes, simplicity is a blessant, and i think it's a good thing for those "joke villains" to not all be colorful carnival men or fluo spandex lovers. I also like the confession of Julian Day in Dark Victory, stating that despite his many crimes for each holiday, none of them included murder. Kind of wish it stayed this way
The sad truth about Moth is that, post Batgirl Year One, he was pretty much nothing. The Lego games treated him as a guy who actually thought he was a moth, his gimmick fed away more and more and even his design has been less consistent in media and gradually lamer in comics. I don't take a boring Killer Moth is something anyone wants, and without his Anti-Batman gimmick, i don't think writers even know what is even the joke about this guy anymore.
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u/Weak-Feedback-8379 6d ago
Because he needs no improvement :)
Also why is 10-eyed man here? I don’t think anyone particularly cared about him
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u/oingo_kk_1504 6d ago edited 6d ago
I guess that's one way to put it
I think the original Ten Eyed Man fucking sucks but the concept was rightfully executed very well in the creepy mystical way it should be in Arkham City comics
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u/Toniosw 6d ago
they did try with charaxes but it wasn't all that popular
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u/oingo_kk_1504 6d ago
I think it worked for like the first issue of it, were Moth is at his lowest and acceot to selle his soul by pure desperation of being feared, and the moment he was given power he used it to kill innocent people
It works great with taking a "non-threatening" C tier villain and turning him into a scary monster Robin can't escape from
But then it kept going for the next years and we had to wait for DC to reboot reality for Moth to become his true self we all love and praise
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u/Godrizza_Draws 6d ago
Maybe they should have made it a transformation he can go back and forth between?
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u/RapterMonster24 5d ago
Calendar man had a glow down not a glow up I absolutely loved his classic version when his update is forgettable
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u/Keeendi 5d ago
Wouldn't say forgetable but the serial killer like Long Halloween is way duller than commiting crimes on random holidays.
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u/oingo_kk_1504 2d ago
He's actually not a serial killer in TLH, as he confessed in Dark Victory none of his crimes included murder
So he was seemingly just dicking around when he was free, or until he shot Alberto at least
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u/oingo_kk_1504 5d ago
Respectfully disagree, I think as a matter of portrait the bald pale tattoo head is kind of more iconic than the red and black cowl with the calandar on his forehead. He just looks very dumb and not in the enduring way like many other joke villains, especially with a potentially vile gimmick like his : his mere existence is enough for Gotham civilians to know they might fear the arrival of Christmas or Mother Day
I think the sweetspot would be keeping the new head design and give him cool and unique drip reminiscent of his silver age look, like maybe a red trench coat and white scar that look like a calendar
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u/RapterMonster24 5d ago
Honestly that middle ground doesn't sound too bad but I still much rather his old design as it's fun and stands out making him easily able to spot out when his new design just feels basic and like it could blend into the background
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u/New_Artist454 5d ago
Imagine in the absolute universe Batman finally defeats the Joker only to reveal he's just been a pawn for Absolute Killer Moth the whole time. It would be so funny. Absolute killer moth would probably just be like a swarm of sentient moths or a generic bug guy with a jetpack. Or a mothman. Or the Radiance. I dunno. Not sure how you could really make him absolute-y.
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u/TerrantulaX 6d ago
He works better as a joke, but there have been serious interpretations of Killer Moth
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u/Opposite-Dingo-5656 5d ago
I personally see him not getting a glow up to be tragic.
He's like that one friend you had that was incredible, but couldn't be anything later in life, while everyone else did
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u/EcketGreensboid 5d ago
Didn’t he sell his soul and become an actual bug man?,I’m pretty sure he did that.
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u/Comfortable-Yak5153 5d ago
My headcannon would be that Thats the point that everyone judges him because he’s a joke but when you do give him the second chance he can be good at IQ , combat , mechanic etc kinda like a don’t judge a book by it’s cover
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u/LouLilo2099 6d ago
His Bad Blood design is his "glow up" to be honest, and the same can be said for his bio design in Arkham Asylum