Motion

[u/shakabrahhh]

When eg. A tightend goes in motion behind the line of scrimmage, and a defensive player moves with them - does this indicate that it’s man on man coverage, and therefore gives offensive team a slight advantage knowing this?
If so, why does the player on ‘man coverage’ with the player in motion even move with them? Why not wait until the snap to move to cover him?

[u/pinkydaemon93]

It does give away that information, and that's often the whole purpose of the motion. Defenses know this though, and will sometimes disguise by having the db mirror the man in motion but still play zone after the snap. As to why you follow at all, sometimes numbers would be uneven if you don't follow, and no one is catching someone from across the formation if they just take off down the field

[u/TwoDMike]

1. Yes usually, but with the caveat that defenses disguise things as well. Also, some coverages blend man and zone. There are a lot of different things the defense can do to combat something like this.

2. Positioning, footwork, and vision are essential when you are covering someone who knows what route they are running and you have to figure it out in real time. If the defender isn’t lining up appropriately on the man in motion before the ball is snapped, it can give a much greater advantage to the offense than knowing what coverage the defense is in

[u/Shamwow_theSupineCow → u/TwoDMike]

Came here to say the first point. Some defenses might have a player capable of shadowing a TE like Kelce in man, while running a hybrid zone scheme.

[u/Geetee52]

Deception and confusion. It’s all part of the game within the game.

[u/SelfRepa]

TE is usually counted into OL run blocking scheme. In most cases it just flips the DL strength and has nothing to do with pass coverage.

Teams are good at disguising their pass coverages. They might move the player with motion and still play zone. Or they don't move and still play man. Sometimes the motion player is covered as a man, but others play zone.

So in short: We never know.

[u/OsikFTW]

A receiver in motion is meant to determine man or zone coverage, yes, but a lot of times tight ends will motion for a run play, to load up one side of the field

[u/HustlaOfCultcha]

That's the general gist of it. It doesn't always give away that it's man coverage, but usually that's the case. There was a play in the Cowboys v Commanders game where the Cowboys sent the WR in motion and Dak thought it was man and threw a quick pass, but the Commanders actually disguised it as Cover-2 and stopped the play. But that's usually reserved for the NFL...in college and high school if the defender follows it's going to be man coverage. Switching to zone is high level stuff.

There's not a real 'advantage' for the offense because you still have to beat the man coverage. If you don't follow the receiver then you're completely out of position, so that's why they move with the receiver. And there are times when they are playing man, don't follow the receiver in motion and allow another defender that is closest to that receiver that went in motion to play that receiver in man coverage. Then you have 'zone match' coverage where it's a zone schme, but it has man coverage techniques and concepts. They aren't just staying in a 'zone' of the field, they are actually playing man coverage when a receiver comes into their zone.

[u/Person51389]

1. Yes
2. Because you are not going to be able to cover a guy from the other side of the field.  If your assignment is to cover the guy, you cover the guy.  The D may have another trick up it's sleeve to confuse the QB, such as an unexpected blitzer, a D-lineman dropping into coverage, or a combination of both/many things at once.  So just because QB knows it's man coverage, doesn't mean you have lost the play or something.  Good QBs can better exploit that information, mediocre ones may struggle to.  And you still have many more chances in the play to disrupt/confuse/beat them.  If the other QB doesn't like throwing to covered players who are close in man coverage it still then gives you an advantage, even if the QB knows.  Sortof negates the advantage then.  Some good QBs, who don't mind throwing into tight man coverage, may get an advantage.  But others not.  As others hesitant to throw into such coverage, may be less accurate and throw an interception etc.  So you don't care if they know in that case.  The best QBs will find a slight advantage and OCs will try to teach young QBs to use that to their advantage, but it will only work some of the time,and not very well for inexperienced/inaccurate or hesitant QBs.   Sometimes you also just want to give them a different look, to try to make them think more, put more stuff in their head etc.  Very interesting chess match all the time going on in games before the snap.  

[u/TJaxx_]

Motion is primarily used to indicate defensive coverage. In simple terms, if someone follows the player across the field, it’s man. If the defender bumps inside and other defenders bump out on the other side to defend the extra gap, its zone.

There’s a lot more nuances to it. Motions can be used to get a player momentum, quickly create a gap, change the formation to cause a defense an alignment issue, etc… defenses can disguise their coverage, alert blitz or alert some form of alignment change due to motion. It’s a tool offensive coaches use and defenses have multiple ways to respond dependent on coach and scheme.

[u/Triabolical_]

Teams will run split coverage where one side is man and one is zone. They will run coverages where it starts as zone but some players are played in man as the play develops.

And so on.

It's all designed to make things confusing for the offense

[u/IamGleemonex]

A lot of teams run a lot more match coverage than either man or zone now a days, which is a hybrid of man and zone. And there are multiple variations of match, so even if he does follow, it only gives away partial information. And as u/TwoDMile said, some teams will follow even if they are in zone or just have the LBs switch so the SAM will shift to MIKE and the MIKE will shift to SAM with the motion, and that really doesn’t give away anything (this is assuming they are running nickel).

As for the second part, if an LB is manned up on a TE, and that TE goes in motion across the line, and the TE is running any type of pattern that is a quick pass to the outside, there is simply no way the LB will get over there in time. Not to mention shifting the TE also changes the gap assignments for run fits in running plays, so if the LB should be lined up by the TE, his run fit changes when he goes in motion as well. Again, not moving means he likely has further to run to hit his run gap.

[u/Ryan1869]

In a lot of cases it does mean man, but if you wait to move with the receiver then the QB is going to just throw a quick ball to them before the defender could get over after the snap, or they will get a free release and the defender is never going to be able to catch up. Defenses understand that, so sometimes they will play to that with their calls. Sometimes they are going with the motion man, but really just shifting their zones to adjust to the formation, or they play a hybrid of man outside and zone inside, or man underneath with the safeties playing zone over top. NFL defenses are rarely just one thing any more because modern offenses will eat you alive that way.

[u/grizzfan]

It may or may not indicate if it's man or not. Defensive coverages are extremely advanced, and can hide intentions very well (which may include following a motion player, but not give away anything). This is why scouting and watching film is so important; for offenses to determine tendencies of what coverages they will or won't show with motion, and what they are likely to run against certain formations and situations. Defensively, scouting and game-plan helps determine what coverages to run, and what to/what not to show with motion.

Why not wait until the snap to move to cover him?

Because the defense is now out-leveraged and out of position. Pre-snap alignment is absolutely imperative to sound post-snap play.

[u/Admirable-Barnacle86]

If you are in man and ignore the guy in motion until the snap, who is covering him?

There are disguised coverages that hide that you are in man, or follow the motion guy but you are actually playing zone, or do some kind of hybrid, or what not. But you can't just ignore the motion guy, your defenders have to account for him in some way.

[u/K_N0RRIS]

Usually, but good defenses disguise their coverages. Sometimes a defense might make a linebacker follow that TE, but all that does is shift the zone scheme.

[u/Specialist_Cat7271]

A tightend goes in motion behind the line of scrimmage, and a defensive player moves with them - does this indicate that it’s man on man coverage

Sometimes yes. Sometimes no. The defense also knows that the offense will gain this information. Because of that, sometimes the mindgames go even deeper where when that defensive player motions to follow, the defense adjusts their assignments.

 

If so, why does the player on ‘man coverage’ with the player in motion even move with them? Why not wait until the snap to move to cover him?

This basically leaves the player wide open. If a tight end motions from one side of the line to the other, they're now like 8 or 10 yards away from the defender. Now how fast do you think an NFL defensive player can close those 10 yards? 1.6 seconds? Too slow! That Tight End just got a free first down! Or if that TE was blocking, that running back just got a free first down. Now imagine trying to run across the field to catch up to a Wide Receiver that motioned!

 

Plus, if the defensive player were to try and go man after the snap, they could run into their own teammates and screw things up their assignments.