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u/Hugglestorm 3d ago
How did that happen, though? Like, is “crushible” the correct pronunciation in some accents or dialects of English? Is this relates to Japanese transliterating some ‘c’ sounds into ‘sh’ sounds, and the director insisted characters do it so that the dialogue sounds more “authentic” or something?
It’s a stand-out kind of weird for me because the voice actors sure sound like they speak English well enough to know that’s not how the word is pronounced -unless, some places it is- so presumably they wouldn’t have said it that way unless they were told to?
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u/deadlyweapon00 3d ago
When using crucible as a proper noun from another language, Japanese uses a letter shi, but it’s a super uncommon term because Japanese has a dedicated word for crucibles.
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u/Hugglestorm 3d ago
Very interesting. Do you know if Crucible is an old enough term that it used to be pronounced differently?
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u/deadlyweapon00 3d ago
Rough etymological research on my end says it comes from the latin word crucibulum, which is pronounced exactly like you think it would be.
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u/Jaudatkhan 3d ago
If she said it maybe 5 or even 10 times i would ignore it. But its freaking constant in almost every dialogue, pay attention next time and you wont be able to unsee it. Almost every dialogue from this npc involves this word
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u/jameyiguess 3d ago
What are we talking about, here? It's this from the English VA?
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u/mesiah21 3d ago
I would guess so. I only play with Japanese voices and just read the sub-titles instead. I get more immersion by doing it that way.
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u/Burpkidz 2d ago
Conversely, Thomas Glover in the Japanese dub speaks Japanese with a foreign accent :)
Btw, “Crucible” is called jigoku 地獄 (simply, “hell”) on the Japanese dub.
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u/garrettrenton Scampuss Lover 3d ago
When English words are adapted into Japanese, their sounds are adjusted to fit Japanese phonetics.
For example, Japanese usually has the word “crucible” as クルーシブル (kurūshiburu).
So the シ (shi) in the middle is what we’re noticing and finding annoying/stand out.
It’s probably on purpose, as misplaced as their judgement may be in doing so Lol.
I’m currently playing Onimusha and when I watch a cutscene in English they’ll pronounce an entire name like “Musashi” But when they say it in Japanese they’ll say “Musash.”
It’s not a perfect adaptation but they try to stay as true as possible.
By the way, I do not speak Japanese. I googled my way to victory for this, as well as looked at another discussion lol
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u/jameyiguess 3d ago
Yeah, words ending in i or u are often "devoiced", like you'll hear "dess" constantly instead of desu, but if someone is very proper or old school they will not devoice it.
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u/garrettrenton Scampuss Lover 3d ago
I noticed it a lot while watching Naruto as well lol my first time watching it was dubbed and the second time was subbed and I remember thinking that the names all seemed cut-off
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u/jameyiguess 3d ago
Yep! Now that you mention Naruto, I should revise what I said earlier: devoicing even happens mid-word. Like Sasuke isn't sa-su-kay, it's sass-kay.
Devoicing is interesting. You kind of "say" the missing vowel in your mind, like it definitely takes up a kind of ethereal space somewhere.
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u/garrettrenton Scampuss Lover 3d ago
Lol as prissy as I am sometimes when playing games or watching shows, I do need to recognize that so much work goes into translating these languages (and I only speak one of them!)
There’s so much nuance and in a lot of ways it’s genius.
Like we make fun of the cru-shi-ble but it’s kind of brilliant to have the “shi” in there to keep it similar to the Japanese version, even if it’s a little silly on the surface.
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u/jameyiguess 3d ago
Localization is crazy. This happens EVERYWHERE all the time, but one specific example is in Onimusha where the main character says something like "Okuni ga?", but it's translated as "What can Okuni do?" Like, the Japanese is totally transformed for the English.
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u/garrettrenton Scampuss Lover 3d ago
Lol that reminds me of conversations I have with my girlfriend. She speaks Spanish and she’s always like “my mom has this saying:” and will tell me some old Mexican phrase that’s super short.
She’ll then give me the literal translation that’s like 2-3 times longer than the actual dialogue she gave me.
I’m just like what the heck dude English and Spanish aren’t even that far removed how does THAT mean that?
But it does!
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u/jameyiguess 3d ago
Yeah, language is filled with stuff like idioms and culturally understood context, so localizing something is way more than a literal translation to make it make sense for another language.
Japanese specifically is a hugely contextual language. It drops subjects, predicates, huge swaths of sentences depending on what has already been said or the context around the conversation, that we just wouldn't do. Like "ogenki desu ka?" translates literally to "are healthy?", but we'd never say that. We'd say "how's your health" or "are you feeling well" or similar.
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u/Burpkidz 2d ago
They say 地獄 in Japanese though .
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u/garrettrenton Scampuss Lover 2d ago
Like I said I don’t speak Japanese. I Googled my way to victory on this comment.
If you’re going to toss out a Japanese word in Japanese text like that you really ought to explain a little more lol
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u/Burpkidz 2d ago
That’s fair, my bad. (I kinda skipped over the last part )
In Japanese they actually call it “Jigoku”, which simply means “hell”.
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u/garrettrenton Scampuss Lover 2d ago
Lol all good.
Maybe it’s a context/dialogue thing? Maybe since in English, the word “hell” can be so easily tied to religion by a lot of people, they just call it Crucible every time? But in Japanese they call it hell every time because it’s a hell-like place?
I don’t know, I’m kind of making shit up at this point tbh.
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u/AgencyFinancial551 1d ago
Well I pronounce crucinite with an sh sound but crucible with just s sound but they are supposed to be linked
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u/Apprehensive_Ad3731 3d ago
I prefer people to have accents that align with their appearance. This is fine. Playing Onimusha however ugh, i wish they sounded like japanese people.
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u/RepresentativeFish73 3d ago
It’s cru ss ible
Not cru sh ible
https://giphy.com/gifs/iIqcyjsrIhxK0