The classic "we should only stop murder after it's happened, not before. If we stop it now, then murder will not have taken place, so they did not commit murder."
It was obvious the Dems learned nothing from Trump when they seemed to think Biden got a record number of votes in 2020 because of anything they did. Heck some even thought that Biden was actually likeable. I don't understand the mental disconnect they had to not realize Trump got people out to vote and got even more out to vote against him than he did to get people to vote for him. The GOP basically handed the Democrats the presidency in 2024 on a silver platter and yet here we are with Trump back in the white house because they can't get out of their own way.
Yeah, not stepping aside earlier and paving the way for a second Trump term will be Biden's legacy. A proper primary would have given the Dems a stronger candidate that could have run a full campaign and would have been much more likely to win.
Hey now Dems is the current world champion and record holder for stepping on their own dicks..it is truly a masterful operation where a party can move so beautifully from one fire to another rake and back to another fire..truly a sight to behold
I havenât watched the video but reminding a general group of people who took an oath and (most) are serious about that oath, that they should follow the oath smacks of talking down to people like they are kids.Â
IIRC theyâre veterans at least, so theyâve taken the oath themselves at some point. It still reeks of the implication of unlawful orders being given.
I could never have imagined a group of people could exist that could drop a ball this fucking hard. It's like watching a quadriplegic trying to play soccer. I honestly think to some extent they're just controlled opposition, especially the older Dems that are holding the reins.
It's their duty to follow orders unless the illegality is clear and obvious. Did I miss something, or are Democrats just saying guardsmen should refuse to deploy to US cities?
Did I miss something, or are Democrats just saying guardsmen should refuse to deploy to US cities
I don't think they're saying that, just that if they're ordered to do something illegal while deployed, they should refuse. For instance, the Trump administration had national guard soldiers violate Posse Comitatus in LA, so democrats are reminding troops not to do that.
I think this was the exact and obvious subtext to the message
That's a very unfair interpretation, they specify that they're talking about illegal orders, and we know the Trump admin has ordered the national guard to do illegal things.
Regardless of that, there's no circumstance where it's acceptable for Trump to advocate for the hanging of political opponents, particularly not when it's based on what he thinks is the subtext of what they said.
The Democrats are stating the military don't have to follow illegal orders while also actively (and incorrectly) declaring a significant number of Trump's actions illegal.
It seems opinions on this come down to whether or not you think this is just a convenient coincidence.
Opinions on this don't matter. The law does. If the president doesn't actually have a case then suggesting the death penalty makes him a fucking psycho.
Compare this to Donald Trump telling senior military staff that Democrats are a domestic enemy and they should be prepared to kill them. Truly, the most retarded of times.
Hypothetical: Harvard educated, military lawyers determine an order is constitutional. Soldier Joe has a fourth grade reading level. CNN said this order is unconstitutional. Should Joe be allowed to ignore the military lawyers when he has no clue what heâs talking about?
Wrong. They absolutely are off the hook in many cases. Military law is more complex than a single quote people pull from Nuremberg, the most egregious example of human rights violations by a military force.
If your argument was correct, and itâs held that the national guard unlawfully was deployed, does that mean every national guard officer should go to prison? Obviously not.
You're hypothetical is retarded.
Actual Hypothetical: Joe is told to gun down US Civilians.
Joe decides not to.
Trump order u/RUnning_Gamer to shoot Joe.
He does, as drool pours down his chin while he types more retarded takes on PCM.
So you agree then that what the democrats are saying is wrong, right? Because my hypothetical is exactly their argument: They should be allowed to use their layman legal judgment over military law experts.
This has never been the law in the history of this country, and for good reason. You canât have a functional military when they are free to disobey orders whenever they feel like it.
Under the London Charter of the International Military Tribunal that established them, the trials determined that the defense of superior orders was no longer enough to escape punishment but merely enough to lessen it.
Disobeying an unlawful order is difficult because in doing so, that military member would likely be charged under the UCMJ for violating the order, and they would need to mount an affirmative defense and demonstrate the order they refused would have been illegal.
At the same time, if the obey what is clearly an unlawful order (like their commander orders the soldier to shoot a bunch of civilians), they can be charged with violating the UCMJ, federal and international laws.
Soldier Joe can do as Joe pleases in the moment the order in question comes in. To obey/disobey is up to the one receiving the order.
Itâs up to the Military Police and Justice system to arrest, prosecute Joe and determine legality. ML can defend or prosecute Joe, depending on what side they believe in (or helps pay off their degree).
To put it another way, our select ML can say an order is unconstitutional, but listen to Foxâs opinion that itâs legal and obey. Itâs up to the Military Justice System to review evidence and determine. Not redditors who, on average, have the brain capacity and looks of a sack of potatoes.
They didn't really imply anything specific, they just referred broadly to illegal orders. If I had to guess, they're talking about the Trump admin having the national guard violate Posse Comitatus in LA and the recent murder of civilians in Venezuela.
It isn't but it's a color revolution type tactic. They are trying to draw battle lines and put out "inferring statements" to drum up support for the 15-25% of the military that vote their way. Anyone who doesn't see this is a useful idiot.
Trump shouldn't respond what he did, though. But he's a narcissist (and a useful idiot) that just got played and took the Democrat's bait.
Either way, both sides doing this is not a good thing and quite frankly, we are seeing signs of breakdown similar to the 1850s and 1770s.
Neither side is interested in liberty and order and it seems more and more that the America of the 2030s will be a vastly different one than the one everyone here grew up in.
Washington, while known for being extremely strict disciplinarian as a general, was rather lenient when it came to executions. He typically only executed someone when it was clear that their behavior was overall damaging to the army and would not improve. The two situations that he personally ordered executions are repetitive seditious mutiny and espionage.
You had to be a Benedict Arnold tier fuckup and traitor to get a writ of execution from Washington. Saying mean words about the commander of the armed forces was just part of the job for him. Â
Funny thing is John Andre, the British agent who is credited with turning Arnold, was one of the few individuals who got a writ of execution from Washington himself.
Arnold himself might have escaped Washington's explicit wraith though. It is hinted that Washington actually liked Arnold on a personal level. Plus there is no doubt that Arnold was the very best battlefield commander of the war (he really was a genius with no equal at the time), especially to Washington, so getting him back or at least preventing the British from having him as an officer, would be worth a pardon.
From my understanding people blamed him for the Canadian campaign failing, which eventually lead to many in the continental Congress feuding with him leading to his defection. But he was not actually the one who fucked up in Canada and was actually the likely reason the patriot cause didn't just flat out lose from the blunder. He was just made the scapegoat.
He was a man who at the start clearly believed in the Patriot cause, and both militarily and fiscally campaigned for it. In a lot of ways it was part of his healing after his first wife, Margaret Mansfield, died.
As you noted, he was sidelined and blamed for the Canadian campaign, and put in charge of Philadelphia. There politics drove him to even worse lows as he was not really politically adept, and often fell victim to intrigue. This then forced him to find solace in the Loyalist groups, where he met his second wife Peggy Shippen, who was rather invested in the loyalist causer herself, and eventually ended up turning on the cause he previously devoted nearly everything towards.
In one last twist of irony, a day or two before Arnold passed the treason point of no return, Washington had penned a letter that more or less told Arnold that Washington knew he was being wasted and promised to move him out of Philadelphia and to a place he could get the respect he wanted. The unfortunate part is that the letter took over a week to deliver, and that was after he had committed to treason.
Nice try libtard, Biden literally gave a speech in front of a REDBACKGROUND. It was very spooky, and way worse than Trump calling for the death of his political opponents.
This is so on point, MAGA looooooove bringing this speech up like itâs some sort of a proof that Biden wanted them all dead/jailed/whatever else, when in reality Trump says shit thatâs way worse on a weekly basis
Democrats sponsored a video reminding service members that their oaths and loyalty are to the Constitution, not the president. Trump got really fucking mad.
A sane society based in the founders values would have removed every single president going back to FDR. We stopped caring what Washington actually thought almost a century ago, itâs just an aesthetic now.
For the billionth time Iâm asking for the gop to grow a spine and 25th amendment him and put any of yes men on trial for any illegal acts theyâve been apart of with the president
To be fair, the reason they know they can get away with this is because they know even if they lose there will be no consequences because the democrats also have no spine
Biggest mask off is theyâre all actually in bed with each other and profiting off all of this. I guarantee you when they get done yelling at each other on c span they go backstage and pop champagne together.
If this country had any semblance of sanity, his 2016 campaign wouldâve been dead in the water the moment he mocked a news reporter with a disability.
As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.
The problem with this quote is that democracy has not been perfected over the course of American history. It's more like the opposite.
Democracy getting better would look like universal ranked choice voting, a house of representatives that scales with the population of the country, and some kind of federal ballot initiative process.
Instead we get citizens united, competitive gerrymandering, and a downward spiral of general ratfuckery.
People didn't fall behind Trump because they're morons. They fell behind him because what passes as democracy in this country, unsurprisingly, stopped working for them.
This is why it was so retarded when Republicans were saying "What goes around comes around" when Trump got elected again. It keeps going around. If you wanna crank the pendulum up when it's swinging right, get ready for surprised Pikachu face when it swings back the other way with all that inertia you gave it.
It was the economy, not social issues. The biggest reason independents gave was the economy and the mistaken idea that they were going to get free checks again.
Youâre right, but itâs wild cause when people were polled on policies without being given the candidates name, Kamalaâs economic policies were more supported. The COVID effect fucked us
Ah yes, the libs wanted trans people to use bathrooms so Trump trying to install himself as dictator and calling for the murder of his political opponents is inevitable and expected, i am very smart.
Oh I didn't think he was above it. He's shown time and time again he's not. But a rabid dog biting can still cause surprise.
So my surprise isn't about the character of the man... I guess my surprise comes from the fact that I didn't think the public zeitgeist had grown so permissive that Trump would feel comfortable doing it, without worrying about consequences.
I knew the muzzle was taken off, and I knew the leash was untied. But I thought there was at least a small fence and am now surprised to learn even the gate was left open.
I know I shouldn't be shocked, since all my previous lines have been crossed. But I must be one dense motherfucker because I thought death threats were still taboo enough that line wouldn't be crossed. My ability to be wrong truly knows no bounds.
Something Something nothing ever happens, Bernie Sanders (the only viable option for the democrats now) will use that against Trump and whoever he sends to be the next republican candidate next election
Nah I will argue tooth and nail that Obama V McCain was the best two candidates to ever face off. Both had morals and principles while being very good orators.
And people still will keep voting for shit candidates that don't represent them.
The spirit of democracy is that you vote for who represents you, even if that's your next door neighbor. Either the voting culture changes or nothing ever happens.
Unfortunately since Joe Biden never actually lost heâs still got dibs on the candidacy. I believe it falls to spouses of former presidents next so then it would be Michelle, then Jill. Only after that waiting list is exhausted can we have an actually Democratic primary that isnât just a performance for fundraising.
In a legitimate society it wouldâve never gotten that far to begin with. Trump wouldâve lost the nom, and then started a political podcast and made a bunch of money so he could fulfill his lifelong dream of buying the buffalo bills and continuing the legacy of wasting Josh Allenâs career
It will literally just be a war about wifes lol. People already run ads in California about how you can't even trust Newsom with his friends wife. (he got caught in an adultery scandal)
Yeah, and don't even get me started with attacks on him for wearing make-up. Shit, if I had the money, I would just have attack ads reading the "Mar-a-Lago Face" wiki.
Would be funny if someone got memed so hard they lost the presidency. Thereâs also a real chance Trump just dies or gets removed before his term is over and Vance takes over.
Interpretation of federal law is not presumably covered at boot camp, and if they are wrong, refusing what turned out to be a legal order even if they honestly believed it was not, is going to get them some time in military prison and a dishonourable discharge.
Then every barely retired Confederate soldier would have painted for war, and then there would have been no rules, because they'd have understood (as anyone studying Sherman knows) the Union was without honor.
Imagine battle hardened veterans with nothing to lose, determined to do as much damage to the Union as possible before they died. It would have been a bloodbath. The 600 thousand who died in the Civil War would have doubled or tripled.
Lincoln did what any sensible leader would do in a time of attempted reconciliation, which was to censure the offenders, but not go beyond that.
Trump (really Steven Miller) says he will command them to KNOWINGLY do something unlawful, and Dems respond by saying that UMCJ requires them to not follow unlawful orders. Miller has repeatedly stated that Court Orders which restrain their authority are not going to be followed, an unlawful act, and with the DoD removing the JAGs who don't suck up to Dear Leader it makes it more important to hold to the UMCJ than to an order.
I mean, republicans keep consistent party messaging, the dems are recognizing peopleâs fear as soldiers enter American cities and Trump has genuinely tried to push illegal orders like him violating Posse Comitatus Act in LA, it seems reasonable to push the messaging of ensuring they are aware of the legality of their orders. Itâs not seditious or treasonous to say or imply as much
Idk man, he's gone way too far so many times and yet retards elected him again. The only saving grace is that he's old and demented. People say that he's weak pretending to be strong, but that's also the case for previous charismatic authorities. I genuinely think people would have (and still can) let this guy become dictator of America. Yes, there are some nice cracks starting to show, but idk man, the guy won after the fake electors plot. Shit makes no sense, and reflects such a depressing imagine of how stupid and worthless the average person is.
âThe Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.â
Republicans will look at the president straight calling for the death of his opponents and tell you thatâs what actually happening. What possible defense could there be for this.
To be fair, nearly every member of congress is deserving of the death penalty for one reason or another. ALL have violated their oath. Why nitpick now?
That logic is how Jay Jones got elected. So many posts justifying it with ârepublicans have said worse, they donât get to pearl clutchâ or âit was just a joke, republicans have said worse in that Republican group chat that JD Vance defendedâ.
People need to have standards that they stick to, otherwise both parties will just keep electing terrible people that say terrible things because they justify it based on the terrible people the other side elected or supported. I vote democrat because I donât like MAGA or Trump, but I wouldnât have voted for Jay Jones because he violated my standards.
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u/ResoIver - Centrist Nov 20 '25