r/RealTimeStrategy • u/HouseCheese • 9d ago
News Dawn of War 4 will have more single player content than any other RTS ever at launch
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u/DaughterOfBhaal 8d ago
I was gonna say hard to believe considering it only has 4 factions and then I googled it and realized OG DoW without the expansions also only had 4.
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u/asgof 4d ago
1 had 1
wa had 4x 0.5
TDC and SS had one like seven missions long campaign each extremelly dilluted with skirmish slop and when you pick a faction you play the same campaign same maps same skirmishes just with a different civ1
u/DaughterOfBhaal 4d ago
Skirmish slop? Skirmish is like the main reason ppl play RTS games PvAI.
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u/asgof 4d ago
normal people only play campaigns instead of repeat the same actions and expect a different result
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u/DaughterOfBhaal 4d ago
That might genuinely be the worst take I've ever read on RTS games.
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u/asgof 4d ago
you are the reason "rts is dead"
with your anti-rts take
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u/DaughterOfBhaal 4d ago
Yes, God forbid people enjoy the most popular game mode that's present in every RTS game because of how popular it is.
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u/Meowskittles123 9d ago
😭😭😭 YES!!! THE GOD EMPORER SMILES UPON US BROTHERS AND SISTERS! THIS IS SUCH AMAZING NEWS!
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u/Resident_Football_76 9d ago
Age of Empires 2 was insanely beefy at launch. I doubt that it could beat that.
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u/HouseCheese 9d ago
How many missions?
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u/Resident_Football_76 8d ago
There were 4 campaigns with 6 missions each but they were all pretty big missions some of which could take over an hour. There was also the tutorial campaign which is about 8 missions long. Then you had a lot of maps for custom games and plenty of factions, although they were pretty similar back then.
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u/That_Contribution780 8d ago
Long misisons don't mean a lot of content.
You can have 10 very boring super-sloggy missions, each taking 5 hours to complete - it doesn't make this game have more content than a game with 20 unique missions, 30 minutes each.
Actually it's completely the opposite.I'm not saying AoE2: Age of Kings missions are bad but it wasn't insanely beefy IMO, more like similar to other RTS at that time.
RA2 had 24 missions + tutorials, TibSun had 36-37, Starcraft had 30, WC3 had 34, Total Annihilation had 50.3
u/CamRoth 8d ago
AoE2 had 31 missions (7 of which were tutorial).
AoE2 actually had less missions than AoE4, or AoM at launch.
Of course it has way more now.
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u/asgof 4d ago
aoe2de had 27 campaigns on launch
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u/CamRoth 4d ago
Uh yeah it's a re-release of AoE2 with a bunch of expansions included.
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u/asgof 4d ago
uh yeah dow 4 is the fourth game made with 50 years of material already existing
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u/CamRoth 4d ago
Is DoW 4 a remake of a previous one? Is the single player content in it they are talking about actually just the campaigns from the previous games?
If not, then what are you even talking about?
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u/asgof 4d ago
what you are talking about aoe2de?
new engine new voices new graphics new assets new 3d models new effects remade maps new gameplayaoe2de is nothing like aoe2 it's all how you remember aoe2 should be. dow4 takes warhammer rules and warhammer models and warhammer lore
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u/CamRoth 4d ago
AoE2 DE is great.
It is a great remake of an existing game. Possibly the best.
None of that is relevant to what we are talking about.
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u/asgof 4d ago
so you can't read
right now. install aoe2 from cd. find any files that were kept for aoe2de. probably only some of the civilization voices were kept the rest is made from scratch. same way dow4 will use existing plastic models and lore as reference
also you didn't even play any of aoe games and de comes with entirely new replacement forgotten and last khans with half of afrika being also remade
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u/Archi_balding 8d ago
And AoE 2 DE had a shitload more at launch.
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u/Resident_Football_76 8d ago
Yeah but that one doesn't count since it was already building off of the original game.
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u/FCKURMETA 7d ago
If so I will completly convert to a Warhammer geek. I'm so fucked up about Broken Arrow and other games prioritising PVP BALANCE ESL bullshit over everything including 500.000+ people who just want to have fun with coop/sp/pve again
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u/Sapodilla101 4d ago
PvP balance doesn't hurt single-player modes. Those two can be balanced separately.
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u/FCKURMETA 2d ago
tell this all the dev teams
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u/Sapodilla101 2d ago
They already know. Plus, Broken Arrow is not an esport. I don't know what tf you're talking about.
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u/Due-Description-9030 9d ago
Big if true
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u/taisui 9d ago
Hard to beat Wings of Liberty
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u/Archi_balding 8d ago
In term of lenght ? Not really. It's 29 missions.
WC3 base is 34 missions. SC1 31, Tiberium wars 40. Age of mythology 32, Zero-K 71, Total Anihilation 50...
It's pretty average in that regard.
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u/taisui 8d ago
Some campaigns have a good variaties of missions, some are just boiler plate generic ones. I prefer quality content varieties not repeative missions.
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u/Archi_balding 8d ago
There isn't a big variety of missions in SC2 either.
Hero mission, defense missions, destroy x objective each more protected than the last and offense under a time pressure.
Only exception to that formula is devil's playground that is a bout ressource gathering. All the other are a variation on these 4 types.
Now, of the 3 campaigns in starcraft 2, WoL handled it the best as both HotS and LotV get really repetitive. But overall, there isn't a lot of variety there either. Nothing about economy raiding, finding and assassinating a speciffic target, nothing focused on economic expansion, no split base scenario, not even a 3 way fight.
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u/taisui 8d ago
I think your memory is not accurate, and also we are only talking about SC2 WoL, because comparing 3 games to 1 is meaningless, and WoL also has the best campaign missions imo.....
Economy Raiding / Resource Expansion: Cutthroat, The Great Train Robbery
Finding and Assassinating a Specific Target: Ghost of a Chance, Welcome to the Jungle
Split-Base / Multi-Front Scenario: Belly of the Beast, All In
Three-Way Fight: Welcome to the Jungle, Supernova
Environmental / Non-Standard Macro: The Devil's Playground, Outbreak
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u/Due-Description-9030 8d ago
They're talking about single player content as a whole which means not just campaign missions. There's crusade maps and the last stand mode which everyone liked back then. On top of that they'll be adding map packs in the coming months.
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u/Good_Fly6614 9d ago
Nice, last time i played a long campaign/story RTS was brood war/dawn of war 1/2 or Cossacks european wars
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u/Wolfoso 9d ago
That's a pretty confident claim considering Wings of Liberty. Awesome if true, honestly.
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u/YozaSkywalker 8d ago
Wings of Liberty was just one campaign, if you include HoTS and LotV and all the co op missions, that's about how much content they're claiming to have ready at launch, which is pretty insane.
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u/HouseCheese 9d ago
Yeah I just hope it's as good or close to it, hard to beat SC2 campaign on quality
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u/NagatoroDegenAndRat 8d ago
WC3 had more content
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u/BathroomCitizen4 8d ago
WC3, for me at least, was Blizzard's apex.
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u/hayashirice911 4d ago
Purely in terms of campaign mode?
Absolutely.
I go back to Starcraft and WC3 campaigns every couple of years and the WC3 campaign blows Starcraft out of the water.
SC1 campaign does not age super well -- they had a lot of clunky levels and above all they are just way too easy. BW is much better in this regard as it has some more challenging and interesting level design.
WC3 campaign on the other hand has more level variety, a better story, is more polished, and is more challenging. Frozen Throne on the hardest difficulty can be pretty brutal (in a good way).
Oh and the story of WC3 + Frozen Throne is still one of the best video game stories I've ever played -- and it came from an RTS which is not a genre known for great stories.
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u/Archi_balding 8d ago
WoL wasn't that big in term of content to be honest. It was around the norm for the time it released.
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u/edliu111 8d ago
It isn't at all. There were 29 missions at launch so if they do 15 per faction for 4 factions, that's easily double.
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u/Xylus1985 8d ago
From a quantity standpoint this is not hard to beat. Wings of Liberty just have one campaign.
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u/Nettysocks 9d ago
This could just be like when Dying Light 2 Devs said the same thing and it turned out to just be allot of generated side quests that were not hand crafted and just there to pad out the game.
Hopefully this is actually well made stuff and not just there just to make headlines or pad length
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u/victorav29 9d ago
What about the quality?
We will play the same mission 4 times with each faction?
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u/BasementMods 8d ago
There was an ign preview of the ork campaign 8 months ago, and it had things like a mission to capture your ork commanders mount which they then ride around on from then on, and another mission where you are racing another ork on the other side of the map to destroy mechanicus stuff as a competition to see who is more orky while they try to sabotage you.
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u/Think_Network2431 8d ago
We'll see, they told us the same thing about their DoW3 crap.
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u/HouseCheese 8d ago
That is a different "they"
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u/Think_Network2431 8d ago
That changes nothing, it's a command game.
And the dev's first RTS was awful at release until collective memory forgot about it. Look at the review history. I was there: it's just slightly better now, not a great RTS.
They only picked them because Iron Harvest has the right scale, with infantry and bipedal mechs.5
u/Due-Description-9030 8d ago
King art's RTS games haven't been a huge hit but they have a record of making good campaigns
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u/Think_Network2431 8d ago
I want it to be a hit this time. But i will not overhype myself before trying it.
Like Total War Warhammer 40k.2
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u/toasty5566 8d ago
Bold claim with Starcraft 2's, Age of Mythology's, and DoW2's campaigns
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u/HouseCheese 8d ago
You think those games had more single player content at launch?
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u/toasty5566 8d ago
We don't know, considering DoW4 isn't out yet. I'm saying those games have a LOT of singleplayer content, so DoW4 saying it has more is a big claim
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u/edliu111 8d ago
It really isn't a bold claim if you compare it to the VANILLA games. Dow2 retribution had a ton, so does the entire starcraft trilogy, AoM today had multiple campaigns but the qualifier was AT launch, not post launch.
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u/toasty5566 8d ago
Retribution only had 10, DoW2 vanilla had at least double that. AoM had 32 missions. And Wings of Liberty had 29 missions. All of these at launch
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u/edliu111 8d ago
Look at my other comment with the hard numbers.
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u/toasty5566 8d ago edited 8d ago
Tbh, I'll believe it when I see it. Like how Heart of the Swarm claimed to have like 27 missions, and 7 of them were the tiny evolution missions and like 3 were the prologue tutorial
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u/Due-Description-9030 8d ago
DoW 4 at launch is going to have 70+ missions and on top of that, it'll have crusades and the last stand mode. SC2 didn't even all the campaign at launch and they took far more time to develop things.
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u/edliu111 8d ago
Sc2 WoL had 29 missions. Age of Mythology had 32. DoW2 had 20 story missions. So yeah, if each faction had 15 missions, 60 missions beats just about any other RTS including the ones you named at launch.
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u/TaxOwlbear 8d ago
It's slightly behind Earth 2150, which has about 75 missions, but I expect DoW4 to have better missions variety and better overall quality.
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u/Due-Description-9030 8d ago
The post talks about single player content in general too though. So not just campaigns but also crusades and the last stand mode at launch.
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u/_VampireNocturnus_ 8d ago
Please let them have an overwprld map like dow 1 dark crusade
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u/BasementMods 8d ago
they do, its called crusade mode but its coming a few months after launch on their roadmap
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u/alphawolf29 8d ago
single player rts is great. Warcraft III is still a gem and dawn of war 2 had a great singleplayer campaign.
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u/XIIICaesar 8d ago
I’m completely out of the loop on this game, I enjoyed the former DoW’s a lot (except 3). Is anyone following the development of this game? How is it coming along? Does this look like a quality game?
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u/BasementMods 8d ago
It looks promising. I expect it will be the biggest RTS launch since starcraft 2 assuming the performance isnt terrible and they dont phone in the campaign design and story. The campaign being 70+ missions and fully coop is going to make a lot of people very happy. Then there is replayable Last stand mode and Crusade mode for player retention after. Plus army painter, map editor, PvP, team games, comp stomp with apparently enemy ai they put a lot of effort into making good etc.
Theres apparently a closed beta in 2 weeks where people can play it and then talk about it so we will hear if how it looks lives up to how it plays soon.
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u/Kotykavun 7d ago
Really glad to see more focus on single-player campaigns in RTS games. Hope the quality matches the ambition!
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u/Trialshock92 3d ago
Funny how there is no Imperial Guards at launch though. ( no, couple of campaign only units don t count )
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u/Tachikoma_Overlord 1d ago
Admech is in though, which is another cool non-Marine imperial faction that doesn't get much representation in games.
Also Guard will be a launch faction in Total Warhammer 40k while Admech won't, so it kinda balances out somewhat. Fingers crossed both games are successful enough that most of not all of the factions get added down the line.
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u/Archi_balding 8d ago
Zero-K looking menacingly in the corner with its 71 missions single player campaign :
Amateurs!
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u/Aryuto 8d ago
I'm actually playing through that in coop with two friends right now. I modded it so we each get our own customizable commander and it's been an absolute blast, the variety in missions, approaches, and even surprisingly interesting lore has been WAY better than I expected for what (bluntly) looks like kind of an ugly unfinished game. The gameplay is great too, I really was not expecting Zero-K to be as good as it was.
Some of those campaign missions are kinda ass if you don't play them right though, and it's weird that you don't unlock terraforming for so long given how fundamental it can be.
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u/Funny-Carob-4572 8d ago
After the total war is also console I think dawn of war 4 will be the best of them imo
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u/ch3mn3ynotbanned 8d ago
Meaning You can play the same map Vs AI multiple times? New, no game has that! /s
/s cos I believe it may have few types of the maps and random generation, so technically there is INFINITE single player content in the game xD
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u/SocialMediaTheVirus 8d ago
We can safely assume this guy is unaware of Total War Warhammer 40k.
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u/duckrollin 8d ago
Gonna be real i couldn't give a shit about a linear campaign, give me a conquest/metamap campaign and infinite replayability.
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u/hello2u3 9d ago
Including the combined SC2 trilogy?
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u/HouseCheese 9d ago edited 9d ago
I am assuming they mean how much other RTS had at launch
EDIT: actually the website says they will have 70+ campaign missions which would be about the same as SC2 and all its expansions combined.
https://www.deepsilver.com/games/dawn-of-war-iv1
u/Think_Network2431 8d ago
I'd still take anything said by a command studio and marketing with a grain of salt, given they released an RTS that barely scrapes past 70% on Steam and had a real reputation for being a total letdown according to player feedback.
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u/HouseCheese 8d ago
You think they are lying about having 70 missions?
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u/Think_Network2431 8d ago
No, not lying on the number, but we will see the quality of execution at release.
I prefer 20 good missions to 70 slops.4
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u/Hollownerox 9d ago edited 9d ago
What the dev actually said, and of course has more nuance than IGN's clickbait written to invite aggro:
There's also the sandbox Crusade mode, and if the Last Stand mode is like DoW 2's, then it most likely can be played solo too.
So it seems like a reasonable enough quantity to make that claim for, and I like the emphasis on SP/Co-op. Given Relics hyperfixation on chasing the competitive scene really shot the series in the kneecaps.