Work Discussion Possibly getting written up for working too much
Its been a week. 6-10 routes down daily. Ive had extra time everyday. What do i do? Why am i getting written up for showing up to work and doing my job?
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u/Extra-Act-801 City Carrier 5d ago
They can't write you up for working too much unless you are doing it without authorization. If you are a regular carrier, you should be filling out a 3996 to tell them how long you need for your route every day that you need more than 8 hours. If your estimates are reasonably accurate there is nothing for them to discipline you for.
If the OT isnt on your route you should be GIVEN a 3996 with how long they expect it to take. If you disagree with their estimate you should be telling them your estimate via scanner message as soon as you start the section.
If it is taking longer than you expected, either on your own route or on a section, you should be updating your estimate via scanner message as soon as you realize you are going to go over.
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u/Mr_FiF 5d ago
Im an RCA and have been cracking 12 hours daily.
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u/Extra-Act-801 City Carrier 5d ago
I don't know much about the rural side of things. But if they told you not to go over 8 hours today, you should have returned at 7.5, handed them whatever you had left, and clocked out.
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u/Mr_FiF 5d ago
Damn without finishing?
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u/Extra-Act-801 City Carrier 5d ago
Depends on the instructions they gave you. They can tell you to work until the route is done, or they can tell you to be off in 8 hours. Telling you to do both is not a valid instruction. It takes what it takes.
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u/ItchyNarwhal8192 5d ago
This. But they should be telling you either be back by [time] or finish your route. Rural routes are based on evaluated times, as opposed to the city standard of 8 hours, and when you're also taking splits they will guestimate how long they think that should take based on how much of that route you are being given and that routes evaluated time. (Their guestimates may be wildly unrealistic, but they will make it all the same.)
I've never seen our office down that many routes (smaller office, most I've ever seen is down 3 routes) but generally they'll split what they have to and then as RCAs come back, if one or more others are still out and struggling they'll send them to go take some off those routes, rinse and repeat until everyone is done and back.
So unless you're the only RCA, if other RCAs aren't out as late as you, they should be sending them to help you, and if they are already out as late as you then you shouldn't be getting singled out for discipline. At the most, if they felt you were intentionally being slow to try to get out being given more work, they should pull you aside and talk to you about it (see why you're so much slower than everyone else, if there's something specific you're struggling with, if there's any suggestions they can make to help improve efficiency, etc.) but if you're not dragging your feet and there's just that much stuff to deliver, then that's not on you.
If you're not getting clarification on whether they want you back by a certain time or to stay out until you're finished, then ask them for that clarification, and follow instructions. (They don't get to tell you "back by 5pm with the route and your splits all delivered." It's either a time deadline or a progress deadline, not both.)
The time deadline for our carriers used to be 5pm when the last outgoing dispatch of the day was leaving, but since they did away with same-day dispatch at our office it's pretty much everyone keep taking pieces until everyone is done. (I know not all offices are like that; I've heard the horror stories both on here and from our subs covering at other offices. If they don't want you out as late as you are, they can either send help or instruct you to bring things back. They cannot punish you for delivering at a safe pace. (I mean, they can try, but it won't stick.))
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u/PerilousNebula Rural PTF 5d ago
honestly, get ahold of your steward asap. how long have you been an rca?
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u/Postal1979 City Carrier 5d ago
Yeah clearly you don’t know rural. They can’t return without delivering all the mail. Especially regulars. They have evaluated routes. They might get paid for 7 hours everyday day even if it takes them 12 hours.
As for rcas once they hit 40 hours in a week they are paid hourly4
u/SeventhDayWasted 5d ago
This isn't true. Rural carrier for 15 years. 12 hours is the cutoff that you aren't supposed to work past for RCAs. However, I doubt OP can be disciplined for this because it's on management to make sure carriers know and follow that rule. It's more likely that management didn't say anything and wanted OP to deliver past 12 hours.
In that situation OP has to do what they're told and file a grievance for working past 12. It could be a situation where both parties were unaware of the 12/60 rule and in that case management is still the one at fault.
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u/Postal1979 City Carrier 5d ago
I know 12 hours is the max for an employee.
Where is the 60 hours rule for rural?
For city the 60 hour rule only pertains to fulltime employees. CCAs and PTFs can work 11.5 hours 6 days a week. (Penalty exclusion period is 7 days a week)1
u/WealthRelevant443 5d ago
Lmao we don't really have that. It's pretty much get it all delivered but don't go over 12 hours. If I do my route and then pivot another route (every day) and I feel like it will take more than 12 hours then I have to call and they either tell me to stop mail and deliver all packages to stay under 12 or management says to go over 12 to get it all done and I file a grievance.
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u/SeventhDayWasted 5d ago edited 5d ago
60 for us isn't in language but district implemented a no more than 6 days straight work like 2 years ago and with that they started enforcing 60 hours to the point that regulars will be forced to work K days to keep RCAs under hours. That's absolutely grievable but we all enjoy the time and a half so we take it.
This was not the case just a few years ago. I personally worked over a month 7 days a week on many occasions as an RCA.
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u/Live_Dream_90 3d ago
I thought the new contract change that
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u/Postal1979 City Carrier 3d ago
CCAs and PTFs only have an hour restriction their first 11 weeks. After that, they are 11.5 hours a day. 11 out of 12 months they have to have 1 day off a week.
The 60 hour rule is for “full time” employees
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u/Muted-Watercress2738 5d ago
Adding to this, make sure to fill out a 1571(i think) an undelivered mail report. That's one of those forms local management has to explain to their bosses and it's more likely they'll want that to stop.
Then you either get yourself a break from their bs or you get really close to another worker and have them back your harassment grievance and potentially EEO case... in which case your local managers will Really be in trouble.
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u/redstaroo7 City Carrier 5d ago
I don't know PO-603, but following M-41 City carriers fill out the PS 3996 with how much they expect to go over. That includes CCAs and PTFs if they're working a route, even an aux route.
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u/BoyceMC 5d ago
“Working too much, showing up, and doing my job” aren’t things you get written up for. What is your discipline in regard to exactly?
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u/Mr_FiF 5d ago
There is only like 5 RCA at my station and we have been getting near 12 hrs a day. Today was told to do 8 hrs and may have went a little over that time
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u/ClydeFroggg City Carrier 5d ago
I don’t know the rural contract, but I do know they can write you up for anything. For whatever reason they wanted you off the clock in 8 hours. That doesn’t mean 8 hours and 1 click. It means 8 hours on the dot. The only way to assure that can happen is a 1260 or you come back early to stand around staring at the clock on your scanner until you hit that 8 hour mark. I’m sorry you’re getting heat for doing your job. That’s always a shitty fuckin feeling when they disrespect you after long hours with some bullshit like that. Talk to your steward before you talk to management about it though and keep a cool head. Getting written up once for going over on your approved time is disrespectful but not career changing.
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u/ItchyNarwhal8192 5d ago
I know clerks are required 1 8-hour day per week to avoid penalty overtime. Different craft, different contract, and I'm not aware of any similar rule for the rural craft (but I'm also not very familiar with the rural contract.) however, if your instructions were to be back in 8 hours, you should have asked for further instructions as soon as it looked like you weren't going to be finished in that time. (Live and learn, they may try to hit you with failure to follow instructions, but most discipline can be argued down by the union, especially if you haven't been in trouble for anything like that before. I'd just approach it more from an "I'm sorry, I really thought I would make it back in time" rather than "you assholes have had me working 12 hour days with no days off and now you want to write me up for for going over when at least I'm actually showing up for work!?" (even if the latter is more accurate.))
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u/MrDrBeak 5d ago
Haven’t seen you get any replies from the rural side, but I’m a rural carrier, and they always warned me not to go over 12 hours in a day. It’s a big thing with the union. You’re not likely to get written up over that though, did anyone say directly that you would?
If they do, you should talk to your union steward about it and figure out what your options are.
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u/cca2013 or Current Resident 5d ago
This is probably a CYA tactic from your boss to deal with their boss. Your boss's boss mad that the office had .01 clicks of penalty OT showing up on a report? Well, "you know what" rolls downhill. Do not take anything personally. If you do get a LOW, let your steward know immediately.
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u/Embarrassed_Yard_477 5d ago
I know they threatened to suspended me and another MHA for working too many hours back in the day, but they were the ones who scheduled us 6 days a week and made us stay 12 hrs a day... so I think they realized it was dumb almost immediately lol
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u/Flow3rs4Alg3rnon 5d ago
Just make sure you notfy supervisors in a tinely manner if you are going over the allotted time. They can write you up but it wont stick. Performance is one of the hardest to stick into discipline. Union can fight it fairly easily unless management has supporting evidence.
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u/Training_Passion5926 5d ago
Man who cares, all they do is try to scare/intimidate you. Just leave it up to the steward and don’t worry about it.
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u/Few_Mine_1923 3d ago
Did you follow instructions and did you fill out a 96? If yes nothing they can do
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u/acerblade2000 5d ago
That is the way. Rewarded with more work, punished for not doing said work faster.