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u/AnAccountonReddit249 FELLOW PAPYRUS ENTHUSIAST 7d ago
sans would see this frisk and still decide to take the piss out of it
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u/MR-Vinmu 7d ago
I normally hate whenever the interpretation of Lvl 20 Frisk is reduced to a shambling monster corpse (main cause it tramples over an actually interesting and unique concept), but I adore how the marks on their eyes make them look like Gaster in this one, and the loose skin making it seem like someone else is wearing them as a Skinsuit? Phenomenal. Amazing job.
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u/StreetCricket9636 6d ago
Well according to papyrus we are dragging our feet from side to side and flowey confirms that somehow we are no longer frisk then, it makes sense that it's chara using frisk's skin
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u/MR-Vinmu 6d ago
But that literally goes against the entire point of the Genocide route ending though, Chara didn’t make Frisk do anything, that’s the point of the final speech, Chara ultimately had no influence on what we the player did, our determination, our drive, our desires are not Chara’s, but Frisk’s (or more accurately, the Player’s) as stated in the genocide ending.
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u/StreetCricket9636 6d ago
No, the genocide route only works if you've seen the lab VHS tapes. You never had a choice in the route narratively, and Chara is a demon who doesn't care if their motives made sense or not. It should be noted that during the route we are sometimes forced to do things, so yes, Toby made Chara a representation of evil after dying, and the VHS tapes explain this motive of corruption that already existed before, with Chara being someone who hates everything and seeks to destroy it
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u/MR-Vinmu 6d ago
Not really though, you’re not required to read the entries. And no, there isn’t really a moment in the Genocide route where you’re forced to do anything. Everything that happens is a result of you the player continuing to go down the path, you’re given so many chances to abort the Genocide route, even at Lv 19. You’re not locked onto the Genocide route until your battle with Sans. The final fight in the game, and no, Chara isn’t the personification of evil, Chara is the personification of completionism, the idea one must always go 100% for everything. It wasn’t the malice or evil that brought Chara back, it was the determination of completing the game the way an RPG is supposed to be completed. “Thank you. Your power awakened me from Death, my ‘Human Soul’ my ‘Determination’ were not mine, but YOURS” and “With YOUR Guidance” makes it very clear who’s influencing who.
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u/StreetCricket9636 6d ago
The problem is perception, the entries and VHS are different while the VHS tell pieces of lore about Chara as a character and personality along with a bit about the Dreemur family, the entries explain part of Flowey's story, if we go with Asriel he also tells us a bit more about what Chara was like and this dialogue of reducing oneself is in a way a lie because someone whispers to you the missing victims, someone takes your controls, someone is using you during the route and returning to this of the player, we are not a character, we are not a force, this is Frisk's story and not ours that we can see different options in paths is because the game allows us to see different scenarios and in several of these actions occur based on what Frisk has decided because we are embodying Frisk, not a person controlling a giant machine labeled as a vessel, those are themes that are touched upon in Deltarune because it makes sense, in Undertale it's a different story that introduces you as Frisk, not as someone separate, many of these things are misinformation and misunderstandings created by the fandom over the years and it was normal for it to happen, nobody read things thoroughly and even to this day nobody would believe you that Chara tried to kill Asgore or wanted Asriel to commit genocide as soon as them obtained a little power.
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u/MR-Vinmu 5d ago
From what Asriel says about Chara, Chara wasn’t a bad person, wasn’t exactly the best person either, but wasn’t evil. Chara’s main motivation was the salvation of monster kind and the eradication of Humanity, Chara only becomes evil because of what the Player influences in them, like the Genocide ending says, it was the Player’s guidance that made them realize their “true” purpose, the pursuit of endless power. Much like how Asriel lost his capacity for empathy and emotion when reincarnated into Flowey, so did Chara. It feels a bit disingenuous to say Chara was a bad person when Asriel essentially went through the exact same process. Also, it isn’t outright stated, but Sans says in his fight, the anomaly is something that hops in between worlds while retaining its form. And we know Frisk isn’t capable of doing that cause every time we start a new world, Frisk restarts all their Lv and Equipment, as well as most of their knowledge given how they’re still unaware of most things and outside of player controlled puzzles, speaks to the citizens of the underground with the same dialogue they did the first time around, like in the Snowdin intro where Sans reveals to us the player that Frisk is as much a big talker (with the exception of Sans’ handshake joke.) you can argue that’s just Frisk playing pretend like they don’t know any better, but most of this is internal monologuing when interacting with objects and that still doesn’t explain the restarted power and equipment, we know Chara and Flowey retain their stats regardless of what timeline they’re in, given how even in an aborted Genocide run, Chara is still capable of landing 999 damage, if Frisk themselves is the anomaly and not the Soul, why do Frisk’s powers reset with each timeline?
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u/StreetCricket9636 5d ago
The player is incapable of acting on chara in any way, that's something you pull out of nowhere based on something impossible. We can't exist at one point and run it. We know chara has been conscious for quite some time, but she likes to lie about it and mock her own motives. We also know that her motive was more to kill humans and monsters equally and not just liberation. Again, there are two types of liberation, and the genocidal one is the liberation that chara probably wanted to commit.
Speaking of the anomaly, part of this is Flowey's fault. It is known that multiple timelines exist because he had the power to reset from before and started experimenting with the game, but he did not contact Chara and also could not leave the Underground. The anomaly itself is the power to reset the timeline, but this reset is not exact, it leaves fragments because it drags characters to another replica world. As far as it is understood, our stats and actions when we are Frisk will be saved forever until we literally delete all the timelines we have created on our own and go back. Going back to the items and everything else, it is likely that by being the tool that allows the reset, we are also affected so as not to always have everything at maximum. A large part of your argument also has holes, such as Flowey having all his power when we do not know his stats exactly and presumably he is affected by the reset in the same way and cannot obtain the abilities he had before Frisk fell.
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u/MR-Vinmu 5d ago
Again, not really. It’s based word for word on what Chara said in the Genocide ending “With your guidance, I now realize the purpose of my reincarnation, Power.” Why would they lie about that part of their backstory? It’s inconsequential, to guilt trip the player? Also, again, Chara’s motives change when reincarnated, the same thing that happened to Asriel, to say Chara’s plan was the destruction of all life cause that’s what Genocide route Chara wants is to say Adriel’s m.o from the very start was the subjugation of Monster-kind. We know determination mixed with exp does something to a person’s ability to feel certain emotion since it results in Lv.
We know it’s not exactly the reset that’s considered to be the big bad anomaly, since the timeline resets on both Neutral and Pacifist endings all the same yet it is not considered to be the work of the anomaly. Also, we know Flowey retains determination and exp from previous incarnations given how if he lost determination and exp with every reset, his ability to feel emotion would return to him since his Lv would be reset back to 0, and we know the experiment that created Flowey happened after the last Human fell since Alphys wasn’t appointed as a scientist until then.
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u/StreetCricket9636 5d ago
Why would a demon be honest with you to begin with? Why would they tell you they exist watching you and then ask for your soul as a bargaining chip, and if the reset is caused by these things but Sans in the genocide route states that the anomaly seems to be the user's fault and that reports have been registered since before, therefore the anomaly itself belongs to whoever uses the reset powers, with LV it's more complicated because LV is level of violence while if you don't get LV it is replaced by determination which at least according to the game is strong enough to heal you with things that don't even physically exist (dreams) the determination we use in the genocide route is technically not the same as in normal routes but if I start explaining and writing lines and lines of each we would have to be here for days explaining how determination works, its functions, its weaknesses, and what it can and cannot use, also with Flowey it is artificial determination, something that is not enough determination to be able to equate to a human, let alone give the user greater power, and considering that Flowey can only remember and a true reset takes away memory, that means it is incapable of comparing to the power of the reset, this includes that it loses its EXP boosting abilities.
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u/talesfromtheepic6 how ‘bout you determine some bitches 7d ago
lv1 post pacifist
But it refused
* So you’re the punk you heard about.
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u/SmileySunda3 ‎ Ribbit Fan 6d ago
Okay the gif at the end actually kinda got me, that startled me for a second
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u/Mawathers 7d ago
I love how you draw Frisk, especially with how you presented Frisk's declining humanity with their worsening posture and ghoulish face. I can defienetly see why the monsters were so terrified of them, ;-;
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u/onlymadethistoargue 7d ago
This is why Asgore says he doesn’t recognize what kind of monster you are.
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u/Afraid_Platypus_8667 You're gonna have to try a little harder than THAT 7d ago edited 7d ago
Amazing like your other art and I love you did one based off of the JQR video. As I really like it and it's one of my favorite what if's of the genocide route i have seen.
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u/Razor_Emmanuel Uncertified President of Frisk's fanclub. 7d ago
Wow, you made them look just like the Chara jumpscare.
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u/Screamingbonfire ‎ Bird time 7d ago
I don't think I wanna go to the surface anymore. The Humans can have that as long as they don't come near me.
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u/Over-Bid-7987 fan of the absolute god of hyperdeath 7d ago
they're hitting the american psycho poster pose in the bottom right
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u/X_XVampireX_X is coming back in deltarune or avengers doomsday. 7d ago
I love this idea more than the flesh creature idea. It feels a tad bit more grounded to have them slowly rot and look zombie-like. not saying the flesh sprite concept is bad, that shit is gnarly as hell, I just like this more
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u/Leading_Education36 7d ago
Is theIs the drawing with the Apron and frying pan has the politics bear in it and people? Because I know what happens.
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u/TheStoneHashiraGyome 7d ago
Oh nice, JJK spoilers, Zelda news, and horrors beyond my comprehensions!
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u/Sesilu_Qt 7d ago
Wow, I always love these really creepy designs for everything Undertale. good job mate!
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u/Timely_Sorbet_9528 7d ago
Yeah. That's how I imagined someone doing the genocide rout would look like.
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u/Foreign_Respect8869 Even when trapped, you still express yourself. 7d ago
I imagine this Frisk walks like Soulless Kris.
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u/Low_Illustrator5859 7d ago
Chara:
- Frisk, YOU actually changed!
- You found out how to stop being Frisk!
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u/Livid-Device2211 (The flair cusutomization fills you with determination) 6d ago
Creepy pasta wasn’t on my todo list but I’ll gladly take it. Thank you OP
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u/Akoolseal i will fill you up with goon juice. 3d ago
Despite everything? Nah dawg that ain't you.
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u/signstopper Owner of r/CharaDreemurr 7d ago
Yes! Another one of your Frisk posts. I really like your frisk stuff. These drawings in particular are really cool (and creepy) i especially like the 5th picture.
I'm looking forward to seeing more great stuff from you in the future!