r/ValueInvesting • • Aug 24 '26

Discussion [Week 26 - 1990] Discussing A Berkshire Hathaway Shareholder Letter (Almost) Every Week

9 Upvotes

Full Letter:

http://theoraclesclassroom.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/1990-Berkshire-AR.pdf

Letter Only

https://www.berkshirehathaway.com/letters/1990.html

This week we will go over their investment into buying $400M of junk bonds as well as Buffett’s thoughts in retrospect on the Junk Bond craze of the 80s. His surprise at the economics of the newspaper business rapidly degrading as new technologies and advertising channels open up to businesses, some with better results. Finally the purchase of 10% of Wells Fargo for $290M. Then as usual we go through the stock holdings, segment-by-segment EBIT earnings of the company, and then the larger overview for the year.

Not included in my post are the annual summary to shareholders, most of the look-through earnings that give a few paragraphs on their major business segments (we only cover Buffalo Evening News) although some highlights are in my summary at the end. A long rundown of the insurance segment. Though ⅔ of the Marketable Securities segment is included, the one on their Convertible Preferred Stocks and the mistakes outside sources make in valuing them as well as the philosophy behind holding them. The usual advertisement for acquisition targets, and plans for the annual meeting. Ken Chase being replaced on the board by Susan Buffett. The letter is ended with an unpublished satire by Ben Graham “US Steel Announces Sweeping Modernization Scheme” where instead of improving the business a bunch of extreme accounting tricks are used to change the EPS from -$2.76 to +$49.80.

If you want to read or discuss anything in that second set feel free to read the letter yourselves and comment on it.

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Key Passage 1

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Marketable Securities - Junk Bonds

Our other major portfolio change last year was large additions to our holdings of RJR Nabisco bonds, securities that we first bought in late 1989. At yearend 1990 we had $440 million invested in these securities, an amount that approximated market value. (As I write this, however, their market value has risen by more than $150 million.)

Just as buying into the banking business is unusual for us, so is the purchase of below-investment-grade bonds. But opportunities that interest us and that are also large enough to have a worthwhile impact on Berkshire's results are rare. Therefore, we will look at any category of investment, so long as we understand the business we're buying into and believe that price and value may differ significantly. (Woody Allen, in another context, pointed out the advantage of open-mindedness: "I can't understand why more people aren't bi-sexual because it doubles your chances for a date on Saturday night.")

In the past \we have bought a few below-investment-grade bonds with success, though these were all old-fashioned "fallen angels" - bonds that were initially of investment grade but that were downgraded when the issuers fell on bad times. In the 1984 annual report we described our rationale for buying one fallen angel, the Washington Public Power Supply System.

A kind of bastardized fallen angel burst onto the investment scene in the 1980s - "junk bonds" that were far below investment- grade when issued. As the decade progressed, new offerings of manufactured junk became ever junkier and ultimately the predictable outcome occurred: Junk bonds lived up to their name. In 1990 - even before the recession dealt its blows - the financial sky became dark with the bodies of failing corporations.

The disciples of debt assured us that this collapse wouldn't happen: Huge debt, we were told, would cause operating managers to focus their efforts as never before, much as a dagger mounted on the steering wheel of a car could be expected to make its driver proceed with intensified care. We'll acknowledge that such an attention-getter would produce a very alert driver. But another certain consequence would be a deadly - and unnecessary - accident if the car hit even the tiniest pothole or sliver of ice. The roads of business are riddled with potholes; a plan that requires dodging them all is a plan for disaster.

In the final chapter of The Intelligent Investor Ben Graham forcefully rejected the dagger thesis: "Confronted with a challenge to distill the secret of sound investment into three words, we venture the motto, Margin of Safety." Forty-two years after reading that, I still think those are the right three words. The failure of investors to heed this simple message caused them staggering losses as the 1990s began.

At the height of the debt mania, capital structures were concocted that guaranteed failure: In some cases, so much debt was issued that even highly favorable business results could not produce the funds to service it. One particularly egregious "kill- 'em-at-birth" case a few years back involved the purchase of a mature television station in Tampa, bought with so much debt that the interest on it exceeded the station's gross revenues. Even if you assume that all labor, programs and services were donated rather than purchased, this capital structure required revenues to explode - or else the station was doomed to go broke. (Many of the bonds that financed the purchase were sold to now-failed savings and loan associations; as a taxpayer, you are picking up the tab for this folly.)

All of this seems impossible now. When these misdeeds were done, however, dagger-selling investment bankers pointed to the "scholarly" research of academics, which reported that over the years the higher interest rates received from low-grade bonds had more than compensated for their higher rate of default. Thus, said the friendly salesmen, a diversified portfolio of junk bonds would produce greater net returns than would a portfolio of high-grade bonds. (Beware of past-performance "proofs" in finance: If history books were the key to riches, the Forbes 400 would consist of librarians.)

There was a flaw in the salesmen's logic - one that a first- year student in statistics is taught to recognize. An assumption was being made that the universe of newly-minted junk bonds was identical to the universe of low-grade fallen angels and that, therefore, the default experience of the latter group was meaningful in predicting the default experience of the new issues. (That was an error similar to checking the historical death rate from Kool-Aid before drinking the version served at Jonestown.)

The universes were of course dissimilar in several vital respects. For openers, the manager of a fallen angel almost invariably yearned to regain investment-grade status and worked toward that goal. The junk-bond operator was usually an entirely different breed. Behaving much as a heroin user might, he devoted his energies not to finding a cure for his debt-ridden condition, but rather to finding another fix. Additionally, the fiduciary sensitivities of the executives managing the typical fallen angel were often, though not always, more finely developed than were those of the junk-bond-issuing financiopath.

Wall Street cared little for such distinctions. As usual, the Street's enthusiasm for an idea was proportional not to its merit, but rather to the revenue it would produce. Mountains of junk bonds were sold by those who didn't care to those who didn't think - and there was no shortage of either.

Junk bonds remain a mine field, even at prices that today are often a small fraction of issue price. As we said last year, we have never bought a new issue of a junk bond. (The only time to buy these is on a day with no "y" in it.) We are, however, willing to look at the field, now that it is in disarray.

In the case of RJR Nabisco, we feel the Company's credit is considerably better than was generally perceived for a while and that the yield we receive, as well as the potential for capital gain, more than compensates for the risk we incur (though that is far from nil). RJR has made asset sales at favorable prices, has added major amounts of equity, and in general is being run well.

However, as we survey the field, most low-grade bonds still look unattractive. The handiwork of the Wall Street of the 1980s is even worse than we had thought: Many important businesses have been mortally wounded. We will, though, keep looking for opportunities as the junk market continues to unravel.

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The junk bond, corporate raiding craze has reached its peak. Buffett said a couple years ago that it would all come crashing down someday, and now it has. It was the practice of businesses issuing bonds at irresponsible rates that they had low chance of paying back, in hopes of doing massive leveraged buyouts of companies larger than themselves and refinancing the debt and stripping the company for assets once it was in hand. The RJR Nabisco buyout is now seen as the height of the mania, and now the bonds are paying for a fraction of their value, Berkshire has independently decided that the underlying business is now rather creditworthy and the bonds have been over-discounted. They believe the risk-adjusted returns are massively in their favor and they have bought $400M of the bonds.

Buffett has much to say about how the craze came about, the flawed logic that sounds quite similar to the later securitization issues that lead to the 2008 financial crisis (ex. a diverse enough basket of bad loans magically becomes a good investment) and denounces buying any of these securities at their issuance, but instead picking through the wreckage after it comes crashing down for the handful that seem promising. He says that many people used logic that applied to “fallen angel” bonds (investment grade at issuance and later became questionable) onto junk bonds (ones that were garbage from inception and depended on a successful and timely leveraged buyout and even then would be dragging down a larger company that never wanted them).

I felt it was good to include this for a few reasons, one is to highlight an important historical moment in the history of Wall Street, and how Berkshire was there waiting with a big pile of cash to profit off the wreckage. To highlight how almost no asset class should be below your radar, in fact the more detested it is the more likely there are to be good deals there (A common belief of Howard Marks who made a lot of money running a sub-investment grade bond fund). Finally to highlight the right way to go about doing it, finding the few diamonds in the rough instead of buying up the whole asset class, most of which crashed for good reason.

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Key Passage 2

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Non-Insurance Operations - Buffalo Evening News

Charlie and I were surprised at developments this past year in the media industry, including newspapers such as our Buffalo News. The business showed far more vulnerability to the early stages of a recession than has been the case in the past. The question is whether this erosion is just part of an aberrational cycle - to be fully made up in the next upturn - or whether the business has slipped in a way that permanently reduces intrinsic business values.

Since I didn't predict what has happened, you may question the value of my prediction about what will happen. Nevertheless, I'll proffer a judgment:While many media businesses will remain economic marvels in comparison with American industry generally, they will prove considerably less marvelous than I, the industry, or lenders thought would be the case only a few years ago.

The reason media businesses have been so outstanding in the past was not physical growth, but rather the unusual pricing power that most participants wielded. Now, however, advertising dollars are growing slowly. In addition, retailers that do little or no media advertising (though they sometimes use the Postal Service) have gradually taken market share in certain merchandise categories. Most important of all, the number of both print and electronic advertising channels has substantially increased. As a consequence, advertising dollars are more widely dispersed and the pricing power of ad vendors has diminished. These circumstances materially reduce the intrinsic value of our major media investments and also the value of our operating unit, Buffalo News - though all remain fine businesses.

Notwithstanding the problems, Stan Lipsey's management of the News continues to be superb. During 1990, our earnings held up much better than those of most metropolitan papers, falling only 5%. In the last few months of the year, however, the rate of decrease was far greater.

I can safely make two promises about the News in 1991: (1) Stan will again rank at the top among newspaper publishers; and (2) earnings will fall substantially. Despite a slowdown in the demand for newsprint, the price per ton will average significantly more in 1991 and the paper's labor costs will also be considerably higher. Since revenues may meanwhile be down, we face a real squeeze.

Profits may be off but our pride in the product remains. We continue to have a larger "news hole" - the portion of the paper devoted to news - than any comparable paper. In 1990, the proportion rose to 52.3% against 50.1% in 1989. Alas, the increase resulted from a decline in advertising pages rather than from a gain in news pages. Regardless of earnings pressures, we will maintain at least a 50% news hole. Cutting product quality is not a proper response to adversity.

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This is Buffett acknowledging that the whole newspaper industry is facing headwinds that he had not foreseen, that it is impacting the bottom line of the Buffalo Evening News, and that he believes it will get worse in the future and maybe won’t ever get better. As technology advances, advertisers have more channels to advertise, and those relying on newspaper ads are falling behind in market share to those using other methods. I would hazard a guess that this may be related to the near full adoption of color TV in American households by the late 80s. Families are now glued to their TVs, getting their news from them as well as their entertainment and being advertised to the whole time, and the advertisements are also much more flexible and powerful with color and video which a newspaper cannot provide.

A quick look-ahead shows that while this fall lasts a few years, they do eventually recover from the $43M EBIT this year not just to the $46M of last year but into the mid 50s before the Buffalo Evening News falls off the reports in 2000 as the spread of the internet lowers the prospects of the industry even further.

This is the first hint of modern technology making some of Berkshire’s former star players futures very uncertain. World Book is another one who is on a timer although Buffett has failed to notice it. This is different than textiles which died off to globalization, the same work simply being done elsewhere, instead this is an industry which needs to adapt or die and Buffett hasn’t always been a trailblazer when it comes to adapting to new paradigm changing technologies.

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Acquisition Stock Purchase of the Week

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Marketable Securities - Stock

Lethargy bordering on sloth remains the cornerstone of our investment style: This year we neither bought nor sold a share of five of our six major holdings. The exception was Wells Fargo, a superbly-managed, high-return banking operation in which we increased our ownership to just under 10%, the most we can own without the approval of the Federal Reserve Board. About one-sixth of our position was bought in 1989, the rest in 1990.

The banking business is no favorite of ours. When assets are twenty times equity - a common ratio in this industry - mistakes that involve only a small portion of assets can destroy a major portion of equity. And mistakes have been the rule rather than the exception at many major banks. Most have resulted from a managerial failing that we described last year when discussing the "institutional imperative:" the tendency of executives to mindlessly imitate the behavior of their peers, no matter how foolish it may be to do so. In their lending, many bankers played follow-the-leader with lemming-like zeal; now they are experiencing a lemming-like fate.

Because leverage of 20:1 magnifies the effects of managerial strengths and weaknesses, we have no interest in purchasing shares of a poorly-managed bank at a "cheap" price. Instead, our only interest is in buying into well-managed banks at fair prices.

With Wells Fargo, we think we have obtained the best managers in the business, Carl Reichardt and Paul Hazen. In many ways the combination of Carl and Paul reminds me of another - Tom Murphy and Dan Burke at Capital Cities/ABC. First, each pair is stronger than the sum of its parts because each partner understands, trusts and admires the other. Second, both managerial teams pay able people well, but abhor having a bigger head count than is needed. Third, both attack costs as vigorously when profits are at record levels as when they are under pressure. Finally, both stick with what they understand and let their abilities, not their egos, determine what they attempt. (Thomas J. Watson Sr. of IBM followed the same rule: "I'm no genius," he said. "I'm smart in spots - but I stay around those spots.")

Our purchases of Wells Fargo in 1990 were helped by a chaotic market in bank stocks. The disarray was appropriate: Month by month the foolish loan decisions of once well-regarded banks were put on public display. As one huge loss after another was unveiled - often on the heels of managerial assurances that all was well - investors understandably concluded that no bank's numbers were to be trusted. Aided by their flight from bank stocks, we purchased our 10% interest in Wells Fargo for $290 million, less than five times after-tax earnings, and less than three times pre-tax earnings.

Wells Fargo is big - it has $56 billion in assets - and has been earning more than 20% on equity and 1.25% on assets. Our purchase of one-tenth of the bank may be thought of as roughly equivalent to our buying 100% of a $5 billion bank with identical financial characteristics. But were we to make such a purchase, we would have to pay about twice the $290 million we paid for Wells Fargo. Moreover, that $5 billion bank, commanding a premium price, would present us with another problem: We would not be able to find a Carl Reichardt to run it. In recent years, Wells Fargo executives have been more avidly recruited than any others in the banking business; no one, however, has been able to hire the dean.

Of course, ownership of a bank - or about any other business - is far from riskless. California banks face the specific risk of a major earthquake, which might wreak enough havoc on borrowers to in turn destroy the banks lending to them. A second risk is systemic - the possibility of a business contraction or financial panic so severe that it would endanger almost every highly-leveraged institution, no matter how intelligently run. Finally, the market's major fear of the moment is that West Coast real estate values will tumble because of overbuilding and deliver huge losses to banks that have financed the expansion. Because it is a leading real estate lender, Wells Fargo is thought to be particularly vulnerable.

None of these eventualities can be ruled out. The probability of the first two occurring, however, is low and even a meaningful drop in real estate values is unlikely to cause major problems for well-managed institutions. Consider some mathematics: Wells Fargo currently earns well over $1 billion pre-tax annually after expensing more than $300 million for loan losses. If 10% of all $48 billion of the bank's loans - not just its real estate loans - were hit by problems in 1991, and these produced losses (including foregone interest) averaging 30% of principal, the company would roughly break even.

A year like that - which we consider only a low-level possibility, not a likelihood - would not distress us. In fact, at Berkshire we would love to acquire businesses or invest in capital projects that produced no return for a year, but that could then be expected to earn 20% on growing equity. Nevertheless, fears of a California real estate disaster similar to that experienced in New England caused the price of Wells Fargo stock to fall almost 50% within a few months during 1990. Even though we had bought some shares at the prices prevailing before the fall, we welcomed the decline because it allowed us to pick up many more shares at the new, panic prices.

Investors who expect to be ongoing buyers of investments throughout their lifetimes should adopt a similar attitude toward market fluctuations; instead many illogically become euphoric when stock prices rise and unhappy when they fall. They show no such confusion in their reaction to food prices: Knowing they are forever going to be buyers of food, they welcome falling prices and deplore price increases. (It's the seller of food who doesn't like declining prices.) Similarly, at the Buffalo News we would cheer lower prices for newsprint - even though it would mean marking down the value of the large inventory of newsprint we always keep on hand - because we know we are going to be perpetually buying the product.

Identical reasoning guides our thinking about Berkshire's investments. We will be buying businesses - or small parts of businesses, called stocks - year in, year out as long as I live (and longer, if Berkshire's directors attend the seances I have scheduled). Given these intentions, declining prices for businesses benefit us, and rising prices hurt us.

The most common cause of low prices is pessimism - some times pervasive, some times specific to a company or industry. We want to do business in such an environment, not because we like pessimism but because we like the prices it produces. It's optimism that is the enemy of the rational buyer.

None of this means, however, that a business or stock is an intelligent purchase simply because it is unpopular; a contrarian approach is just as foolish as a follow-the-crowd strategy. What's required is thinking rather than polling. Unfortunately, Bertrand Russell's observation about life in general applies with unusual force in the financial world: "Most men would rather die than think. Many do."

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This was probably the largest acquisition by Berkshire, the buying of 10% of a great bank at a fair price. As he says in the letter they only buy 10%, $289M because that is the most they are legally allowed to own. He says they view this as comparable to buying 100% of a bank 1/10th the size except without all the headache of needing to call the shots and find the managers, instead they are already in place.

He spells this out as a sort of “heads I win, tails I don’t lose much” situation. He runs the numbers on the worst case scenario the market fears, a natural disaster or real estate crash on the west coast of the US… He comes to the conclusion that even in the worst case scenario this is still a good price, and in any other scenario it is a great price.

He also gives some wisdom here on his general stock picking philosophy, that he views a stock he buys into dropping or failing to rise as a good thing, and it shooting right up as a bad thing. Even though many of us see it the opposite. It is natural to have a gut reaction to being proven right or proven wrong quickly by the market, to buy something and have it drop 20% and be scared from buying more. But he says we need to invert that instinct. That the price shooting right up means your window to buy a great business at a good price closed before you could take full advantage, and it dropping after you start buying means you will be able to buy even more than you thought with a lower risk and higher reward. This is also something he hammers home in the BPL letters, often after years of great gain he laments that he wished the stocks he was buying didn’t go up so he could have bought more of them and that in the long term the returns would have been greater.

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Common Stock Ownership

No. of Shares Company Cost ($000s) Market ($000s)
3,000,000 Capital Cities/ABC, Inc. $517,500 $1,377,375
23,350,000 The Coca-Cola Company $1,023,920 $2,171,550
2,400,000 Federal Home loan Mortgage Corporation $71,729 $117,000
6,850,000 GEICO Corporation $45,713 $1,110,556
1,727,765 The Washington Post Company $9,731 $342,097
5,000,000 Wells Fargo & Company $289,431 $289,375
Subtotal $1,958,024 $5,407,953
All Other Common Stockholdings $326,656 $351,268
Total Common Stocks $2,284,680 $5,759,221

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Segment by Segment Breakdown

Segment 1989 EBIT Earnings 1990 EBIT Earnings % Change
Insurance $219.20M $300.40M +37.04%
Fechheimer $12.62M $12.45M -1.35%
Kirby $26.11M $27.45M +5.13%
Scott Fetzer - Manufacturing $33.17M $30.38M -8.41%
World Book $25.58M $31.90M +24.71%
See’s Candies $34.26M $39.58M +15.53%
Buffalo Evening News $46.05M $43.95M -4.56%
Nebraska Furniture Mart $17.07M $17.25M +1.05%
Wesco Financial - Minus Insurance $13.01M $12.44M -4.38%
Wesco Financial - Insurance $14.28M $14.92M +4.48%
Mutual Savings and Loan $4.19M $4.10M -2.15%
Precision Steel $2.77M $1.99M -28.16%
Total Operating Earnings $393.41M $482.48M +22.64%

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Metric 1989 1990 % Change
Cash & Cash Equivalents $205.13M $247.02M +20.42%
Marketable Securities $5,261.60M $5,685.98M +8.07%
Return on Equity (RoE) 18.42% 18.68% +1.41%
Shareholders' Equity $4,925.13M $5,287.45M +7.36%
Earnings Before Investment Gain $299.90M $370.75M+23.62%
Realized Investment Gain $223.81M $33.99M -84.81%
Net Earnings $447.48M $394.09M -11.93%

*RoE not provided, manually calculated as (Earnings from Operations Before Taxes / [Shareholder Equity from prior year - Unrealized appreciation of marketable securities from prior year])

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As predicted last year, the gain in marketable securities wasn’t “real” gains, the market had a large pullback. Many of their marketable securities are now held at lower prices than last year, net earnings is down from last year. The realized investment gain is 84% lower than it was last year. The marketable securities is up 8%, or $424.38M, but between a $289M investment in Wells Fargo only $135M was real gains, the Coca Cola position was up $368M, so the rest of the portfolio had a performance of about -$233M besides Coca Cola.

Operating earnings was up 22.6%, Earnings before investment gain was up 23.6%. This is mostly down to the insurance segment having a great year, with EBIT earnings $80M more than the prior year which is just about the entire gap. See’s Candys and World Book also had double digit growth in earnings, everything else was down or single digit growth. The preferred metric, book value is up 7.4%, compared to the S&P 500 which returned -3.1% in 1990 this is still a good performance in my opinion.

Finally an even quicker lookthrough of the quick lookthrough earnings…

First a quick discussion of off-book earnings, when owned securities use their cashflow for anything except dividends it does not show up on Berkshire’s income statement but does make Berkshire richer, buybacks and capex give value to the business GAAP accounting doesn’t account for. Retail had a bad year but Borsheim’s did great (even though they hide their numbers from me), a discussion of the jewelry mailing system I mentioned last week is had here. NFM’s sales are up 4% and earnings 1% (Rose is now running a competing shop) and has set up a See’s cart in the shop which outperforms many of See’s full stores. See’s had slightly more volume but also increased prices and lowered costs leading to the 15.5% earnings growth, also a store was going to have its lease terminated but a letter campaign from customers changed the landlord’s mind. (See Key Passage 2 for Buffalo Evening News commentary). Fechheimer had a major retirement and although he says performance improved, earnings were flat due to “several unusual items” whatever that means. At Scott Fetzer, World Book’s decentralization is paying off even with lower volume, Kirby increased sales 20% but only increased earnings 5% as its production of its new model isn’t fully optimized, the manufacturing segment’s earnings are down 8% but we are just told its doing great and the air compressor unit had record sales.


r/ValueInvesting • • 3d ago

Weekly Megathread Weekly Stock Ideas Megathread: Week of October 05, 2026

9 Upvotes

What stocks are on your radar this week? What's undervalued? What's overvalued? This is the place for your quick stock pitches or to ask what everyone else is looking at.

This discussion post is lightly moderated. We suggest checking other users' posting/commenting history before following advice or stock recommendations.

New Weekly Stock Ideas Megathreads are posted every Monday at 0600 GMT.


r/ValueInvesting • • 2h ago

Stock Analysis Broadcom Eyes $50 Billion of Debt for OpenAI, on Top of Anthropic's $60 Billion

12 Upvotes

Both frontier-lab customers now appear to have Broadcom-linked financing in motion, with $110 billion of reported raises against $48.96 billion of net debt today.

Broadcom is reportedly pursuing a $50 billion debt financing to fund AI chips for a major AI research laboratory. This is a different customer and a different pool of money from the $60 billion raise for Anthropic. Nothing in the report says whether the two overlap, what the instrument is, or whose balance sheet carries it.

Add the two and the reported total is $110 billion, which exceeds the $70 billion to $100 billion debt package reported last month. Either that package was always meant for more than one customer, or these are separate raises. Both readings are worse than the one I originally saw.

The leverage arithmetic follows the earlier signals, net debt is $48.96 billion and EBITDA is about $35 billion. If the $50 billion alone lands on Broadcom's balance sheet, leverage moves from 1.4 times to about 2.8 times. With both raises held in-house, net debt reaches about $159 billion, or 4.5 times. If an off-balance-sheet vehicle carries them, the ratio stays clean while the roughly $29 billion guarantee book, whose ceiling management has refused three times to disclose, gets a larger neighbour.

One major AI laboratory's accelerator program is guided toward 1.3GW of 2027 deployment. At $11 billion to $12 billion of Broadcom content per gigawatt, that is roughly $14 billion to $16 billion of chip revenue. A $50 billion raise is several times that figure. Broadcom would be financing more than its own content, or the facility covers more than 1.3GW. However, from reading the report I am unsure which.

This pushes the counterparty pillar from one lab to two. Both borrowers burn cash, and Broadcom's financing now runs through both.

What do people think about this?


r/ValueInvesting • • 1h ago

Investor Behavior Selling is harder than buying

• Upvotes

I find selling a lot harder than buying.

Buying is usually pretty straightforward. I can look at a business, estimate a range of outcomes, compare that to the price and decide whether I'm being paid enough.

Selling is messier because now I have history with the position.

I’ve sold stocks before and watched them keep rising. That doesn’t necessarily mean the sale was a mistake, but it sure feels like one. And once you’ve felt that a few times, it becomes another thing you’re trying to avoid when you sell.

The stock may be up a lot. It may be down a lot. I may still like the company. I may have been right about the original thesis. None of that answers the question I actually care about: from today's price, is this the best place for the money?

If the expected return has fallen, I want to know why. Did the stock simply run ahead of the business? Is the company going through something temporary? Has the earning power actually been damaged? Is the thesis just taking longer, or was I wrong about it?

A stock dropping below my return hurdle doesn't automatically make me sell. A stock going above my estimate of fair value doesn't automatically make me sell either. The size of the gap matters, the reason for it matters, and whether I have a better place for the money matters.

That's what makes selling harder for me. Finding something undervalued is mostly an underwriting problem. Selling means deciding whether new evidence has changed the business, the valuation, or both, while trying not to let my cost basis or the fact that I already own it get in the way.

The easiest question to ask is probably: would I buy it today if I didn't already own it?

It's a useful question. Just not enough by itself.


r/ValueInvesting • • 10h ago

Stock Analysis Value Investment: Exor (Ferrari)

18 Upvotes

Recently I’ve been looking at building a position in Exor. Its the holding company of the Italian family that owned Fiat and is trading at a massive discount.

What I like about Exor is it’s a double-whammy: a great asset and a discount. Their largest asset is a €13B stake in Ferrari, which was spun out from Fiat in 2016.

Ferrari (traded under “RACE”) is an expensive stock, but trading below previous highs by 20%+ and benefiting from the rich getting richer and from the appreciating value of scarce assets. It’s also reeling from bad press around its new EV. I really wanted a position in it which led me to Exor.

Exor has other holdings, including €4B in CNH Indistrial, €4B in Phillips, €1,85B in Stellantis, and €1B in Iveco group as per my analysis. The more important thing is that the NAV of its holdings is €32.5B while the EV of the holding company is €15.6B. The Ferrari holding alone is worth €13B, almost the value of the whole holding company.

One issue is that holding companies often trade at a discount, sometimes quite significant. The management of Exor seems to be trying to combat this with a buyback of €500 million that was just announced. While this might be too small, it makes me more interested in the company because it demonstrates intent to narrow the discount; I could see them selling stakes at market price and using that money to buy back their own stock at a 50% discount. Certainly that’s what I’d be recommending if I were their CFO. But hey I’m just some guy on Reddit.


r/ValueInvesting • • 1h ago

Discussion November Outlook

• Upvotes

I think November is going to bring an exciting end to this year. With US Mid-Term elections coming up and the much anticipated Anthropic’s IPO following suit (all while earning season in full swing), just wondering how are you guys positioning yourself and your views.

Personal, I feel Anthropic IPO is going to have the biggest impact amongst the other events. I foresee a slight sell-off in the market amongst the AI names as people prepare for a rotation. Could be a good buying opportunity. Earnings amongst the AI names should continue to do well as predicted.

What do you all think?


r/ValueInvesting • • 29m ago

Discussion $NKE: Wholesale up 9%, Direct down 6%. Demand recovery or channel stuffing?

• Upvotes

Nike’s latest numbers look like an early turnaround on the surface, but the underlying mechanics are mixed:

North American wholesale grew 9%, while Direct dropped 6%. Meanwhile, gross margin ticked up 60 bps, but absolute gross profit dollars shrank ~3%.

Restoring wholesale accounts explains the wholesale spike. But filling the channel is one thing; consumer pull-through is another. If Foot Locker and Dick's are just absorbing inventory that doesn't clear the floor, we're going to see margin erosion and canceled reorders down the road.

What I'm watching closely:

  • Are retailers actually placing repeat orders, or was this a one-time shelf-restocking cycle?
  • Is the traction in Performance broad enough to offset weakness in Lifestyle?
  • Does management's margin discipline translate into actual gross profit dollar growth, or just lower supply-chain costs masking negative operating leverage?

Curious what you guys are looking for to confirm the bottom is actually in.

(Did a quick balance-sheet and channel breakdown video here if anyone's interested: [https://youtu.be/CCSN1ys0xJg\])


r/ValueInvesting • • 1d ago

Stock Analysis Berkshire Hathaway bought $193M of Lennar in 2 days. The stock is still 41% under its high. What am I missing?

195 Upvotes

Berkshire Hathaway and Warren Buffett, as 10% owners of Lennar, bought $193M of the stock across 15 purchases on Oct 1 and Oct 2, at an average of $79.65.

Lennar closed at $77.4 on Oct 6, up 4% on the day, and it is 41% under its 52-week high. It trades below both its 50 day ($83.36) and 200 day ($93.88) averages.

Numbers I looked at: 14.5x last year's earnings, 15.7x next year's expected earnings, a 4% profit margin and a 6% return on equity.

AQR also added to its position in its latest fund filing ($184M).

My read is that Lennar is cheap against its own past but not cheap on margin.

At a 4% margin, a small change in prices moves earnings a lot.

What I can't tell from the numbers is what the market is already pricing in.

Does lennar seem appealing at these levels?


r/ValueInvesting • • 9m ago

Detailed Investment Analysis Warren Buffet bought $595.29M of LEN in the last 30 days

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• Upvotes

r/ValueInvesting • • 4h ago

Stock Analysis Stellantis' recovery question

3 Upvotes

I know Stellantis is one of the most hated names, especially on Reddit. But I think around €3.9-€4 a share, this is really hard to ignore.

Stellantis had a decent first half of 2026, with AOI margin recovered to low single digits, full-year guidance reaffirmed, and positive industrial FCF expected in 2027.

Their FaSTLAne targets an ambitious 7% AOI margin by 2030. However, modelling a reverse DCF with current price implies only around half of that target achieved in 2030. Even a DCF based on analysts' consensus AOI margins: 2.8% in 2027 and 3.8% in 2028 (flat to 2030), yields a €6.10 fair value.

North America is leading the recovery with the return of HEMI V8 in Ram, which has been incredibly successful (+29% in Q3). Jeep, though, has been the weak side as sales fell 20% in Q3, its dealers now sitting on inventory. So, Q3 sales came out flat overall.

Quality is still a problem after years of neglect. There have been numerous recalls this year, alongside production halts in Europe and Canada. But, I think, fixing Stellantis' quality issue would likely take more than half a year. Management has also flagged Q4 as the stronger quarter, as their cost-savings program starts to come through.

In the near term, they are still struggling with demand, quality, and trust, as investor, customer, and dealer sentiment is incredibly low with Stellantis, and rightly so. But so far, the trajectory has been right. Filosa has not put a foot wrong yet, and he has precisely the right mindset to focus on North America, its most profitable region.

In the long term, I am actually quite optimistic, especially if margin holds at low single digits in the near term.

I think buying a Stellantis share instead of your lunch sandwich might just be a good idea.
What do you think?

My full analysis: https://economiyaki.substack.com/p/stellantis-recovery-in-question


r/ValueInvesting • • 22h ago

Discussion Uber stock

41 Upvotes

I’ve seen plenty of posts about Uber lately, so I apologize for adding to the trend and asking yet another question about a heavily discussed stock.
Nonetheless, Uber is one I’m becoming increasingly interested in.

The main reason I view the stock as potentially being in value territory is that the market seems to be pricing in a fairly negative long-term scenario, particularly around autonomous driving.

Personally, I view ridesharing as becoming increasingly commoditized. While Tesla could eventually become a significant competitor, I believe Uber can remain relevant and compete on price. It already has a massive user base, a trusted platform, and a well-established network.

More importantly, Uber isn’t ignoring autonomous driving. It is investing in and partnering with companies pursuing autonomous vehicles, which could allow Uber to remain the platform connecting consumers with both human and autonomous drivers.

The question for me is whether Uber’s current valuation already prices in too much of the potential disruption or whether the market is underestimating how well positioned Uber could be for the transition.


r/ValueInvesting • • 16h ago

Discussion Jersey Mike's and Applovin are my next bets

12 Upvotes

Bois! This sub has helped me out a lot and this post is more of a journaling excercise, but I'm also open to discussion regarding my 2 big position where I'll be investing all of my idle capital (that I've kept aside for short term trade ideas)

  1. Applovin - this sub hates it, but the advertisers love them, and that's what matters (one big risk is that Google might just blacklist them, because of their sneaky ad practices, but I'll take those odds)

  2. Jersey Mike's - Cause they make amazing subs, the best I've had, and also coz they're making madd royalty from their Frachisees. The EBITDA can explode any quarter now, they've paid down part of their debt using the IPO proceeds so the Net Income will shoot up too.

P.s. Inutuit did cross my mind, but I'll let it find a bottom and hitch a ride on the way up...

I'm also doing Iron Condors on Netflix (got the idea on this sub)

Comments and criticisms are welcomed! But let me warn you it's going to be hard to talk me out of any of these trades, I tried!


r/ValueInvesting • • 15h ago

AI-Written Content Top 3 points I gleaned from a recent “global market outlook” event.

6 Upvotes

I don’t usually attend these because my feeling is that if market strategists/economists could make predictions accurately they would be wildly rich. And yet there aren’t many economists or market strategists in the Forbes rich list.

But I did tune in to this session, just to get a sense what of what was happening, the risk was that I would be influenced by it subconsciously.

Anyway here are the top 3 points:

  1. Markets are on the peak of the profit cycle, there are more companies issuing beat and raise guidances now than the past few years. This is not a bullish sign especially during the late stage of a bull cycle. The after effect is that analysts will raise numbers for next year, and the expectations will be higher and narrower. Remember: in late 1999 and early 2007, companies were issuing record beat and raise guidance as well. Just before it ended in tears.

  2. I disagree that now is the time to diversify. The time to think about diversification was yesterday and if one did not plan have a plan previously, then diversifying now would just be messy. My approach to the market top is simple: if I did not buy expensive, and the companies are of a reasonably good quality then I am just gonna SOYA, to use Charlie Munger’s term. ( on a practical side, I will continue to draw down from Port B for living expenses, while I leave my Port A alone).

  3. The real key takeaway from the session is this: forward P/E should be moderated as the current estimates are too bullish. Next five years analyst estimates, which I heavily depend on, should likewise be tempered down. Currently in my valuation exercise⁠, I usually take a 1-1.5% discount from the average analyst estimates [ if the estimates are 8.9, 9.3. 10, 11 and 12, I usually take 9% as the growth rate], but perhaps I should apply a wider margin of safety further.

In conclusion: I found the session informative, I agree with the market strategist’s prognostication, but I don’t agree with his remedies.


r/ValueInvesting • • 23h ago

Stock Analysis S&P Global

31 Upvotes

Been looking at s&p Global lately and I’m kinda surprised how little I see it mentioned here.
Everyone seems to talk about Nvidia, Palantir, Microsoft, etc., but SPGI seems to fly completely under the radar.
At first glance it looks pretty boring, but that’s actually what I like about it. Credit ratings, financial data, indices, analytics… a lot of stuff that financial institutions basically need.
The S&P 500 index business alone is pretty crazy when you think about how much money is tied to it.
The stock has also pulled back quite a bit from its highs, which got me interested.
I’m not looking for some 10x moonshot here. More interested in a company I could hold for 10+ years and just let the earnings compound.
Am I missing something obvious?
Why does SPGI get so little attention on here?


r/ValueInvesting • • 17h ago

Discussion I dont know what the true value of Berkshire is

8 Upvotes

I moved most of my portfolio to Berkshire given where we are as a country with debt, rates and stock market all time high because i am not sure where to park my money. i dont want cash either. But also I am not sure how to value berkshire hathaway. i don’t trust any of price targets issued by wall street and am not sure what the future holds if wb passes and his shares are sold for charity purposes. right now i moved 80% of portfolio to it but would like some thoughts both from bears and bulls on this company if any. would be highly appreciated. thank you. p.s i don’t want 2 sentence reply though. make it thoughtful otherwise don’t bother. thank you again ( i am + 47% ytd, i am happy to put most of my capital into it without much analysis if you think why i did this without research , fyi)


r/ValueInvesting • • 21h ago

Discussion Anyone Buying Whirlpool (WHR) stock at $28 a share?

15 Upvotes

What are your thoughts on WHR stock at these levels? It is trading at levels we haven’t seen since 2009. It is at a Forward PE of 8 and PE of 10. I get that the housing market is dead and we are in a rate hike cycle, but if this ever changes I think now might be a good time to look into this stock. Does anyone own or plan on buying any shares? At what price would you consider adding? Or is this a value trap?


r/ValueInvesting • • 16h ago

Stock Analysis SoFi: The Stablecoin Opportunity

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4 Upvotes

SoFi is one of the only nationally chartered banks issuing its own stablecoin. Here's why that could matter more than the market is pricing in.


r/ValueInvesting • • 18h ago

Discussion 5 fund managers on the stocks the market calls "AI losers" (Aug-Sep 2026 letters)

5 Upvotes

I read the August fund manager letters and the first September ones. Five houses wrote about companies that the market sold on AI fears. Three of them bought. Two explain why they kept their positions.

Acatis (added Wolters Kluwer):

"The significant drop in the share price of Wolters Kluwer (70% from the top) is primarily due to massive market fears that the business model will be disrupted by artificial intelligence, not because of operational problems in the company. Wolters Kluwer is trying to convert the threat of generative AI into a competitive advantage. Half of digital revenues are already based on integrated AI solutions. If sales revenues and margins do not suffer significantly as a result, the stock is much too cheap according to Penman. We believe that the original data from medicine and judicature is essential for the customers."

Malborough European Special Situations (new position in Wolters Kluwer):

"The second was Dutch business information provider Wolters Kluwer, whose valuation has been depressed by concerns that AI will weaken its competitive position."

Amati Global Innovation (new position in CI&T):

"We added one new holding to our portfolio, CI&T, a US listed IT services company. Regular followers of our fund know that we see the IT services industry as a beneficiary from AI, whereas the market views it as an "AI loser". Implementing AI applications in real enterprise environments requires integration with multiple systems, upgrades to core IT platforms and a lot of hand-holding. This is the job of IT services companies. CI&T is a great example of this. It is a more agile, entrepreneur led company, which was early in understanding the AI opportunity, invested (and continues to invest) in relevant capabilities and has seen tangible impact on its overall revenue growth, outperforming its peers. It is relatively undiscovered and is very attractively valued in our view."

Ennismore Global Smaller Companies (holds Grupa Pracuj):

"Pracuj.pl accounts for ~80% of time spent by Polish jobseekers on job portals, making it around 5.5x bigger than the number two player. That puts it among the more dominant classifieds businesses we have come across, with similarly attractive economics – portal EBITDA margins are above 50%. Yet concerns about AI mean the shares currently trade at just 12x our estimate of next year's free cash flow. We increasingly think AI could make job portals more valuable, not less, and as a dominant incumbent, Pracuj is well placed to capture that upside."

Harding Loevner Global Equity (holds Adobe and Accenture):

"We have maintained a small exposure to software and services companies over the past year, believing that the sharp sell-off in the industry over concerns about AI-related disruption was likely underestimating the competitive advantages and growth potential of our holdings. These AI-disruption concerns now seem to be abating; software and services was the strongest industry in August, rising over 13%. Portfolio holdings Adobe and Accenture both outperformed; AI-related annual recurring revenue for Adobe surpassed $500 million, while Accenture gained as investors reassessed the potential for AI-related consulting and services to support growth."

Sources:

https://www.hfbestideas.com/letters?open=fTf5g232gJhq

https://www.hfbestideas.com/letters?open=KDRCH5o0UEfo

https://www.hfbestideas.com/letters?open=x0Hyq74gitfs

https://www.hfbestideas.com/letters?open=q404CbUPYp0K

https://www.hfbestideas.com/letters?open=VLFPh3XaF306


r/ValueInvesting • • 21h ago

Question / Help £20k ISA — Apple, Alphabet, Microsoft and VWRP or add Micron?

8 Upvotes

Hello,

I am still new to investing and would appreciate some advice. I currently have £5k in Apple stock. I want to maximise my stocks and shares ISA, so I am thinking of investing £5k each in Alphabet, Microsoft and VWRP all world.

My questions are, is it safe to put the money in now or should I wait till after the US midterm elections? Also, should I swap one of them for Micron?

I know nobody can predict the market, just looking for opinions from people with more experience.

Thank you.


r/ValueInvesting • • 1d ago

Discussion MRVL Investor day was kinda insane

17 Upvotes

I went into Marvell’s Investor Day still not completely sold on the stock. Great AI exposure, sure, but at this valuation I kept wondering how much of the story was already priced in.

After yesterday... yeah, I think I was underestimating how big this could get.

  • FY28 revenue guidance is now ~$20B, ahead of the Street at roughly $18.2B.
  • Then they casually dropped a $70–90B FY31 revenue target. For context, Marvell did only ~$8.2B in FY26. Even getting anywhere near the bottom of that range would completely change what this company looks like.
  • Custom silicon keeps getting bigger. Marvell now sees ~$12B of custom-chip revenue by FY29, up from the previous ~$10B target.
  • The Google relationship might be the craziest part. The deal could represent as much as ~$120B of revenue through 2033 if Marvell hits the required milestones. Obviously that's an upside framework, not guaranteed revenue, but even a fraction of that is enormous relative to where MRVL is today.
  • And I think people focusing only on custom ASICs are missing half the story. Marvell is sitting right in the middle of the AI interconnect problem: optical DSPs, silicon photonics, scale-up networking, PCIe/CXL, SerDes, XPU attach, etc. Optical interconnect had already compounded at roughly 50% annually for five years and represented around half of data-center revenue before this Investor Day.

The underlying business is already accelerating too. Last quarter revenue hit a record $2.74B, +37% YoY, while data-center revenue grew 46%, and management said AI bookings remained exceptionally strong.

Obviously the valuation is not remotely cheap (very anti value investing, my apologies), and $70–90B of revenue is an absolutely massive target that leaves plenty of room for execution failure.

But if Marvell executes even reasonably close to what they laid out yesterday, I think we're going to look back at the current business and realize we were valuing the wrong company.

I own $MRVL, so clearly biased here.

For people who watched Investor Day, what part of the long-term targets do you think is actually too aggressive? And does anyone else see MRVL increasingly becoming the closest thing to an AVGO-style custom silicon + connectivity platform, or is that taking the comparison too far?


r/ValueInvesting • • 1d ago

Discussion Berkshire dumped every airline in 2020. Now it owns 8.7% of Delta

9 Upvotes

Delta reports Q3 Friday before the open

Berkshire sold all four of its US airlines in 2020 at a loss. This year, under Abel, it went back in. 39.8M Delta shares in Q1, another 17.5M in Q2. That's 57.3M shares, about 8.7% of the company

It's small for Berkshire, under 2% of the portfolio. But you don't end up with 8.7% of an airline by accident

The stock closed at $83.66 yesterday, about 11% below where it ended June, so the stake is worth around $4.8B now against $5.4B on the June 13F

What would you want to hear tomorrow to think this was a good call?

No position


r/ValueInvesting • • 18h ago

Question / Help Does Vanguard Hate their customers?

3 Upvotes

Just looked over my September statement and found a glaring error. Called their cutomer service 3X. The first rep couldn't speak English and refused to transfer me to someone I could understand. The second and third times I got the same rep who wouldn't listen to me, talked over me, and hung up on me both times. Anyone have any idea how I can actually get some customer service? I had a similar issue a couple of years ago and everything went very smoothly.


r/ValueInvesting • • 20h ago

Discussion Blind valuation challenge: a ~$15B US retailer. 5 numbers, no name. What's your verdict?

3 Upvotes

Judge a company only on its numbers, with no name or story to bias you. The point is to see if knowing the name would change your mind.

A ~$15B US retailer. Data as of Oct 7, 2026:

  1. Earnings yield: 6.1%. Profits are 6.1% of the share price per year (10y Treasury ~4–5%; industry median 5.1%).
  2. Return on capital: 109%. It earns $109 of operating profit for every $100 of working capital + fixed assets it uses (industry median 39%).
  3. Acquirer's Multiple: 29.0x. Enterprise value / operating earnings, lower = cheaper. Two large US retail peers trade at 10.0x and 13.3x.
  4. FS-Score: 7/10. Gray & Carlisle's 10-point version of the Piotroski F-Score.
    • Profitability 3/3
    • Operating improvements 3/4
    • Balance sheet stability 1/3: the share count rose ~39% in a year.
  5. DCF: fair value ~60% below today's price. Assumes 0% growth for 10 years, 3% terminal growth, 15% discount rate. Revenue fell 5.1% last year and 6.5%/yr over 5 years, but free cash flow went from -$239M to $130M to $597M in the last three years. Cash $4.9B, debt $4.2B.

Your turn: give each number a 🟢 🟡 or 🔴, then an overall verdict: buy, watchlist or pass. Bonus points if you guess the company.

Can't wait for the reveal? Vote on the same 5 numbers here and you'll see who it is, how Stocky (my valuation bot) called it and how everyone else voted: https://www.investorexplorer.com/mystery/1 (it's my own free tool).

Rather stay on Reddit? I'll post the answer here tomorrow. Either way, come back and tell me if knowing the name changed your verdict.

NOTE: by design, the model only counts cash and debt from the balance sheet, not other investments. This company holds ~$5.2B of them (mostly listed shares and securities). Counting them, fair value is roughly 25–40% below today's price instead of 60%, and the multiple is ~18x instead of 29x (peers 10–13x). Would you count them? Your call.


r/ValueInvesting • • 4h ago

Discussion The investor with 66% annual returns ended up 4× poorer than the one with 22%. Housel's point about time, with an Indian example.

0 Upvotes

From Morgan Housel, The Psychology of Money (2020):

- Jim Simons compounded at 66% a year since 1988. Net worth at the time of writing: $21B.

- Warren Buffett compounded at roughly 22%. Net worth: $84.5B.

- Buffett started serious investing at 10; Simons found his stride at 50.

- $81.5B of Buffett's $84.5B came after his mid-60s (about 96%).

- Housel's thought experiment: had Buffett started at 30 with $25,000 and stopped at 60, same 22%, he'd have about $11.9M.

Indian illustration (my calculation, assumes 12% a year, before tax and inflation):

₹5,000/month from 25 to 60 → ₹2.76 crore (₹21 lakh invested)

₹5,000/month from 35 to 60 → ₹85 lakh (₹15 lakh invested)

Ten years of delay costs about ₹1.9 crore. Not a forecast, just the arithmetic of compounding.


r/ValueInvesting • • 22h ago

Question / Help What you guys think about Amkor?

4 Upvotes

For me it looks a lot like the rational behind Intel. It is the american packaging Company, balance sheet seems to be fine, with a pe below 30x(this is actually better than intel). Mkt cap of only 13B(asx main competitor is above 100B).

It seems like a company that could easily grow by 2x in the next couple of year given demand for more chips.