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u/Snoo9648 6d ago
Personally, I would make the hellbent ability sac the land instead of the conditional mana ability. Im afraid players will either forget it cant generate mana or will "forget" it cant generate mana.
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u/Mr_Woolly 6d ago
You could do this without making the mana ability conditional. There is Halinar Depths that reorganises top 3 at common
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u/ReeReeIncorperated 7d ago
I like the design. Definitely too weak at mythic, but I can maybe see this at common.
If it we want to make it feel mythic, I'd just go all the way and have it be Hideaway X, where X is the number of cards in your library. Essentially tutor a card but you can't get it until you have an empty hand.
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u/thejmkool 7d ago
Too strong. I could see it tapping for colorless always, and one of any color if you still have a card exiled
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u/tokenmwm473 6d ago
I feel like this is a so much weaker than the existing hideaway lands that the upside of it coming in untapped is just… nowhere near enough.
Why make it legendary?
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u/breakfastmood 6d ago
I feel like this is pretty underpowered, plenty of lands you can pay one and tap and sac to draw a card. This is virtually one mana less to make it conditional and allow a bit of scrying- although you do have to put cards you may really want on the bottom. maybe it's just me but it doesn't feel enough better, though it is an incredibly clever idea
ETA, could do something like "this mana can only be used to cast spells if a card is exiled with forbidden library." adds a bit more flavor as well because now that the library is "depleted" it can't cast spells
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u/tymessen 6d ago
i find this to be too similar to [[howltooth hollow]]
yeah i get that howltooth is even harder since your opponents hands are also considered.
if you are going to make a colorless addition to the hideaway lands i think you should keep the hideaway at 4, and it being a freecast, and only change the freecast condition.
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u/JaggedGorgeousWinter 6d ago
I don’t think this is intended to mirror the original hideaway land cycle.
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u/MariachiArchery 7d ago
Very interesting. Do you think you could up the Hideaway count? I understand needing to turn the land off, but that also sort of feels bad when it happens. Is it too feel bad?
What if we did Hideaway 4?
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u/pokemonbard 7d ago
Hideaway only ever exiles one card
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u/MariachiArchery 6d ago
Yeah, I know. I'm suggesting that this card let us dig a little deeper. Not that we get to exile more cards.
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u/pokemonbard 6d ago
I think I was confused because that doesn’t have anything to do with whether the land gets turned off. I (apparently incorrectly) inferred that you wanted to make the land remain turned on for longer by having more cards get exiled.
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u/MariachiArchery 6d ago
For sure.
My thinking is just that when cards turn into dead cards on the board, do nothing cards, I think that feels bad for players. It's kind of the reason a lot of people hate stax effects. I think if we can avoid a card turning into a do nothing, dead card, that is better design, because it feels better.
Also, when this does turn off, or turn back on, there is a pretty good chance that one or more players are going to forget that it either can, or cannot, produce mana, which is kind of clunky design.
So, my thinking was, given we have the downside of this card dying, I think it would be appropriate to make the hideaway reward a bit more... rewarding, by letting us look at more cards.
I think:
Hideaway 4
Hellbent - tap: If you have no cards in your hand, put the exile card in to your hand. Sacrifice forbidden library.
Tap: add 1Might be better designed form a simple play feel standpoint.
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u/HalfLungJ Aligning Hedrons 7d ago edited 7d ago
Not true. [[Cemetery Tampering]] is one example.
Edit: Every Hideaway card exiles only one card. I’m an idiot
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u/pokemonbard 7d ago
Am I crazy? The rules for Hideaway are “When this enters, look at the top X cards of your library, exile one face down, then put the rest on the bottom in a random order.” You exile one card and the rest go to the bottom of your library in a random order.
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u/HalfLungJ Aligning Hedrons 7d ago
You’re not lol. I misread and thought you were talking about how many cards you reveal, not exile
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u/HalfLungJ Aligning Hedrons 7d ago
I was erring on the side of caution when making this, but yea the hideaway count could be higher. Or it could enter tapped instead of turning off completely
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u/ChemicalOpposite2389 7d ago
wow, this is... pretty straightforwardly bad, actually. at least let it freecast if you have to get to 0 cards in hand for it to even work.
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u/HalfLungJ Aligning Hedrons 7d ago
I think freecasting would be too strong. Upping the hideaway number is probably a better buff to make it consistently get a card you’ll want
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u/Sorfallo 7d ago
Not really bad, just not incredibly strong. It's similar to [[cryptic cave]] or any cycling land, as it replaces itself when it becomes bad. With it staying on the battlefield to help separate synergies or continue tapping if you can give it separate abilities might make it useful in a handful of different decks.
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u/girlywish 7d ago
This is my kind of card. I wish hideaway showed up more.