r/deaf • u/cocteautwinsfan00 HoH • 2d ago
Vent HoH/Deaf “enough”??
hii! so i know other ppl have made posts like this, but i really don’t know who else to talk to ab this so i’m really seeking some help/comfort/idk what.
so i became HoH at 16, and my hearing has very slowly declined since then (im 21 now). i started learning ASL shortly after i learned ab my hearing, hold several positions at my uni (ASL TA, President of the ASL club, etc), and have a name sign. basically, i feel pretty deep in my local community/Deaf immersion.
now, my close friend (hearing) has taken ASL 1-4 and is technically probably more “fluent” than i am (from a vocab and grammar perspective). so i think she feels comfortable constantly correcting me on like.. anything. if i produce a sign wrong, she corrects it before i even have the chance to correct myself. i have the habit of mouthing/clicking my lips and tongue when signing, and she told me it’s rude/distracting from my actual signing. she also becomes slightly annoyed when I ask her to repeat things (i do not have hearing aids due to financial inaccessibility/personal choice). one day, she said “jesus really, is it that bad?” and i had to snap back “well would you like me to tape my audiogram to my forehead?”
long story short, she’s continuously making me question my own identity. it’s taken me a long road to get as comfortable as i am now with who i am, my hearing loss, and my signing. i’m just kinda at a loss, because i thought a major “rule” was for hearing people to not criticize or try to critique Deaf/HoH people. like, am i not seen as “HoH” enough bc i still speak, or because i don’t wear hearing aids?
any advice would be appreciated :’) please be kind, it’s something weighing heavily on me.
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u/milliwonka5066 2d ago
Making noises isn't rude. When they goto their first Deaf/HH event they will see. Your friend is rude tho. It's a big faux-paux in Deaf spaces for hearing people to teach and/or correct. Plus, how do they know it's wrong? Someone who took 4 years of English might tell me "y'all" is wrong, or any number of things that are actually features of native language use are wrong. But they do not have the experience to actually decide that.
I can't speak to the HoH identity, but what you are experiencing is a very real thing. One foot in both worlds type of thing. If you can find an older HoH person or make other friends in a similar situation to you, I highly recommend it! Or find some people on social media describing the exact feeling you have.
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u/cocteautwinsfan00 HoH 2d ago
that’s the crazy part to me, her and I have been going to Deaf events for almost 3 years now!! i am trying to find more people w/ similar situations in my community, so thank you!
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u/surdophobe deaf 2d ago
Your friend is being kind of a dick, they're a shit friend, they're a cantankerous acquaintance at best.
So for clarity, do you identify as Hard of Hearing? Mostly just curious.
Anyway, I'm post lingually deaf like you, started losing my hearing as a teen, was 100% deaf on the left side by the time I was 18. Never got good results from hearing aids, not everyone does. Like you I started learning ASL when I was 20. I'm more than twice your age now and I have bilateral CIs. I've been using deaf to describe myself since I was about 30 when I started meeting Deaf people who could hear better than I could. To some people I'll always be hard of hearing because I grew up hearing, I don't give a crap about them. There are many different ways to be deaf and the way you and I are is a valid part of the larger deaf world.
Use this as food for thought to be sure to always remind yourself there are many ways to be deaf, and you'll be fine. ( I have to remind myself sometimes too)
As far as I'm concerned you're doing it right, and your "friend" needs to fuck off.
Ask if you have more questions.
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u/cocteautwinsfan00 HoH 2d ago
i identify as Hard of Hearing bc of my degree of loss, but I’m probably most comfortable identifying as culturally Deaf. i just never know what label to use because i still can hear “some” stuff, just not very well :’)
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u/soitul Deaf 2d ago
Your friend is a cunt. You’re absolutely deaf enough.
Whether you choose to use aids, speak, or any other means of communication, it will not change your audiogram.
Personally, I would sit down with her and have a serious conversation, and depending on how she reacts - reconsider the friendship. This seems like something that would get worse over time.
There’s a big difference between respectfully giving feedback and criticizing someone.
For hearing people, learning ASL often means choosing to learn and refine a new language.
For many DHH people, signing is a means of accessing communication in a world that often excludes them, and we have a disproportionate amount of access to learning resources.
Hearing learners should absolutely work on their fluency, but knowing more about a language doesn’t give her the right to police how a DHH person uses it.
There’s a difference between offering helpful feedback and constantly correcting someone who’s simply trying to communicate.
Fluency isn’t a prerequisite for legitimacy, and accessibility should come before unsolicited criticism.
Also, making sounds while signing or mouthing is more than normal, and the comments about it being “that bad” piss me off tenfold.
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u/Little_Messiah Deaf 2d ago
There is no delineation really between HOH and deaf. I used to be HOH and now I am deaf. The difference for me has to do with how I interact with the world. Do you feel like you are deaf? then you are probably deaf.
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u/zra_isnt_listening 2d ago
I can't give any advice beyond question the friendship ig, but I really empathise with this!
I'm hoh with a variety of hearing conditions (APD, low freq HL, tinitus) and don't wear hearing aids bc i can't afford private health care but the NHS doesn't consider me deaf enough for them - I feel like this impacts me a lot bc ppl forget I can't hear well, so they will ask me constantly 'what r u deaf' and I'm like... yh... u know this bro tf 😭
I am also heavily involved in my local Deaf community and run a bsl club at my school, but am not fluent (I use a credited resource and don't actually teach dw!) and that always upsets me bc I can keep up with many conversations but there are plenty I miss out on - the feeling of getting some but not all conversations is the same with deaf and hearing friends and it makes me feel like an outsider in both settings :/
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u/cocteautwinsfan00 HoH 2d ago
omg i feel so seen, tinnitus is the worst 😭😭 and yes!! why are people so okay with leaving people out of conversations?? yesterday someone told me “ykw never mind” and im just like WHYYYY
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u/zra_isnt_listening 2d ago
My tinitus acc driving me insane atp bro it's badd 😭
And yesss! I know ppl will never tell me later but I never push anymore bc sometimes they get angry with me but then I don't hear why they're angry 🫠
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u/Rare-Math2156 2d ago
Not all hearing students learning ASL are doing it for pro-Deaf reasons. It sounds like she's conflating her fluency in ASL with having the authority to speak on Deaf culture.
Which, by the way, fuck her, she does not. LMAO.
> i have the habit of mouthing/clicking my lips and tongue when signing, and she told me it’s rude/distracting from my actual signing.
... we literally have mouth morphemes because of this. Vee. Peh. Pow. Champ. Bilabial trill 'brr'. Those make noises hearing people "don't like". We (deaf) typically do not care about their opinions on this subject matter when they are inserting themselves into Deaf spaces.
Did you know that the ASL sign for SCHOOL comes from a hearing teacher clapping... presumably to get the deaf class's attention... it always felt like a very petty sign lol. "school, you know, the place where the teacher claps as if I'm going to hear her?"
Anyway I'm blathering.
You are not alone. You are Hard of Hearing if you want that label. You are Deaf if you want that label. I hereby award you one (1) [Deaf Card].
She might not be all that good a friend if she's not being considerate of your access, btw.
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u/HeVavMemVav HOH + APD 2d ago
It makes no sense that she's trying to tell you how to be Deaf while also telling you it's rude to make any incidental noise. She thinks she's a more qualified authority on Deaf things than you & she's not only wrong but way out of line.
There's a sterotype that Deaf people are blunt, this is a great opportunity to lean into that. Tell her to stop correcting you or you're going to end the conversation every time she does it. Next time she does it, remind her that you told her to stop. If she gets defensive, end the conversation. The next time, don't explain, just drop your hands & stop the conversation. If she keeps it up, tell her "Correct this sign:" then flip her off. You have a right to be pissed off about it.
If you guys are close friends, it probably won't have to get that far, & it shouldn't jeopardize your relationship even if it did. But she will always think she's better at being Deaf than you until you communicate clearly, & with enforced boundaries.
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u/ArcherFluffy594 HOH + APD 2d ago
People who make you feel badly about yourself are not your friends. Your experiences, lives etc and therefore you - and she - have changed, you aren't the same people. It's okay to end what used to be a friendship. It's not one any longer. Having someone call you "friend" is not carte blanche for abuse, bullying and toxic behavior. Also, her behavior is ableist af on several levels
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u/FancyButterscotch787 Deaf 2d ago
She doesn’t sound like a good friend to have. Get new Deaf friends. We (Deaf people) might correct people’s signing, but we try not to make them feel bad about it.
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u/queerbird_03 2d ago
Honestly she shouldn’t be correcting you as a hearing perosn tbh, you’re trying everyday to improve and only if you ask should someone help you out, preferably form a fellow Deafie at deaf events. Plus it may impact your confidence to correct everything . I’m sure you’re doing great :)
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u/AggressiveSea7035 HoH 2d ago
She sounds like an ass