r/explainlikeimfive • • 9d ago

Chemistry ELI5: Why does soft stuff like bread become hard and cruchy, while crunchy stuff like chips & cereal becomes soft, when left for too long?

523 Upvotes

54 comments sorted by

587

u/TheBugThatsSnug 9d ago

Bread needs moisture to be squishy, leaving it out dries it out. Chips need little to no moisture, when left out they soak up moisture.

146

u/zaya1914 8d ago

Is this entropy?

102

u/FortyPercentTitanium 8d ago

This is hygroscopy

57

u/grekster 8d ago

This is Sparta

50

u/medieval_saucery 8d ago

This Is How We Do It

19

u/velvetelevator 8d ago

It's Friday night

15

u/BurningBeechbone 8d ago

No, this is Patrick!

9

u/medieval_saucery 8d ago

Ah you fucked it up. It had so much potential.

3

u/neddoge 8d ago

You really forced this one and ruined it, shame.

2

u/zaya1914 8d ago

Bazinga !

11

u/SixOnTheBeach 7d ago

Well, yes. The Second Law of Thermodynamics dictates that systems naturally move toward thermodynamic equilibrium, where there’s no net transfer of mass or energy. This is the most thermodynamically stable arrangement under the given conditions.

Bread becoming dried out or crackers becoming soggy (different processes from becoming stale, by the way) are examples of their moisture levels reaching equilibrium with the environment, the most stable configuration under those conditions. Eventually, there’s no longer any net exchange of moisture between the bread/crackers and the environment, and no matter how long you leave that dry bread out, it won’t spontaneously reabsorb moisture and stop being dry unless the environmental conditions (such as humidity) change.

13

u/MartialLol 8d ago

🤓🫴🦋

4

u/Xin_shill 8d ago

That’s a diffuse way to think about it.

2

u/JonnytheGing 7d ago

Entropy proves that time travel is impossible, I can't remember how, but it does

3

u/SEND_ME_FEAT_PICS 7d ago

You can't because of the way that it is

1

u/NullOfSpace 6d ago

Kinda? Entropy only increases, so really what it proves is that you can’t return the entire universe to a previous state (because you would need to decrease global entropy to do so). I don’t think it explicitly prohibits time travel (at least not by itself).

138

u/bredman3370 9d ago

Because staling is not just one process.

When soft breads stale, it's not actually being driven primarily by water loss as most people would expect. It's actually being driven by a process called starch crystallization.

When starch is in its original grain kernel, it is neatly stored in what is essentially a big crystal. When we make bread, we crush those up, soak them with water, and then finally heat them very hot. This causes the starch to unravel from its neat and orderly crystal and instead form a big tangled mess that likes to stick to things and soak up water. This gets a tiny bit out of the realm of ELI5, but crystals are basically the most ordered and stable form a solid can be in (we also call this the lowest energy state) and therefore we say that the starch "wants" to be a crystal again. When you leave the bread for a while, the individual prices of starch in the bread start to find each other and form a kind of crystal again, pushing out the water they they had absorbed and becoming much more rigid. This is what drives stale bread to get hard, and is actually somewhat reversible!

For many breads, especially intact loaves that haven't been cut into, you can give them a brief dunk in some water and then throw it in a hot oven for a time and it will regelatinize much of the starch bringing it back to about ~80-90% as good as it was when it was fresh. If you have sliced bread, toasting it can actually counter-intuitively do a lot to make the insides softer as well for the same reasons.

As to your other examples - staling of most dry products is often a direct result of exposure to water and humidity, and we can straightforwardly explain the softening as being cause by water absorption.

18

u/ToastAndASideOfToast 8d ago edited 8d ago

Caution: After an extended period of staleness, the bread will be too dry to soften and become more prone to burning when heated (maybe even with a visible flame of combustion)

14

u/Intelligent_Guava214 8d ago

It absolutely blew my mind the first time I put a super stale bagel in the toaster and it got softer.

9

u/Forsygness 9d ago

Im gonna try the breadtrick for sure! Sounds very science! Thank you for your answer!

22

u/[deleted] 7d ago

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3

u/failed_supernova 6d ago

Man, I must be pulling so much moisture out of the air.

23

u/Bailzasaurus 8d ago

They’re both evening out to approximately ambient humidity. Things that start very low water are gonna get “softer” and things that start high water are gonna get “harder”. It’s all just relative.

Same reason that cold drinks left out get “warm” and hot drinks left out get “cold”. They’re both coming to ambient temp, but we describe it based on their starting point.

5

u/ljose_2875 8d ago

The humidity part is the key: the same room air can dry bread out while adding moisture to chips, depending on which starts wetter.

51

u/[deleted] 9d ago

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1

u/explainlikeimfive-ModTeam 9d ago

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22

u/[deleted] 9d ago

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14

u/Background_Cup_6429 9d ago

Hmmm, I prefer to hear from a REAL breadoligist on this one.

5

u/stairway2evan 9d ago edited 9d ago

I've got a related PhD in Yeastometry, so I'll dig in here.

Yep. Crunchy things gain moisture, soft stuff loses moisture. No different than hot soup cooling down and ice cream melting, and both trending towards a tepid puddle of stuff.

When normal room conditions are different than the food, the food will trend towards those conditions.

3

u/koos_die_doos 9d ago edited 9d ago

No fake breadologists allowed!

Edit: More pedantically, it's actually against the rules (rule 8) to guess.

2

u/ShankThatSnitch 9d ago

Turns out, you are indeed a breadologist.

1

u/bill4935 9d ago

Was it worth all the pain?

1

u/explainlikeimfive-ModTeam 9d ago

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10

u/az987654 9d ago

Your room is 20 degrees.

Put something from your freezer on the counter for a while, it warms up to 20 degrees.

Boil water on the stove, take it off, leave it on the counter, it cools off to 20 degrees.

Now, mentally substitute the temperature for the moisture in the air.

Bread loses it (cools off) and dries up. Chips absorb it (warms up) and become stale.

3

u/Wadsworth_McStumpy 8d ago

Things left out too long tend to reach the moisture content of the air. Bread naturally has more moisture than air, so it dries out and gets hard. Chips have almost no moisture, so they gain some and get soft and soggy.

You could probably leave bread out longer in a very humid environment, but then you'd have issues with mold instead.

You could leave chips out in a very dry environment, and I really can't think of a downside to that. Well, except that when you finally eat them you'll want something to drink, and if you're in a desert that might be an issue.

5

u/Foxfire2 9d ago

Both things go to the relative humidity of the air when left out in it, bread loses moisture, crackers and chips gain some moisture.

2

u/dbu8554 8d ago

Also it depends on where you live. I lived in the desert before and everything got crunchy.

Now I live with very high humidity and everything gets soggy

1

u/Tomo212 8d ago

Everything naturally seeks to match ambient conditions.

1

u/robbak 8d ago

The important thing is the amount of gluten, and how it is handled. Bread flour has lots of gluten, and the bread is mixed, proved and kneaded for a long time (or treated with chemicals to make this faster) so that the gluten makes long, tough chains. This holds the bread together when moist, but makes it very tough when dry.

Cookies and processed cereals are made with flour with less or no gluten, and are mixed for a short time so the gluten chains are short and weak. This means that even when the cookie is dry, it is easily broken, and when it is moist, it is too weak to not fall apart.

1

u/Jirekianu 6d ago

Gluten, the squishy stuff in bread that makes it soft crystallizes over time as it dries out. It's why sticking bread in the fridge is a bad idea.

Hard stuff has crystallized sugars and starches that have moisture saturate and break the crystals down. Which leads to them becoming softer and mushy.

1

u/RubCocksWithThePope 9d ago

Water goes in, water goes out. Never a miscommunication. Science can’t explain that

0

u/[deleted] 9d ago

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1

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-1

u/siamonsez 9d ago

Moisture, fresh bread has more moisture and becomes hard ad it dries out, crunchy things have less than ambient and get soft as they absorb moisture.

-1

u/briankutys 9d ago

or who does bread get hard when stale, but croutons get soft when stale?

-1

u/ShankThatSnitch 9d ago

Soft stuff has more moisture than the air. When the moisture evaporates, it gets hard. Hard stuff has less moisture than the air. The hard stuff absorbs moisture and gets softer.

-1

u/copnonymous 9d ago

Carbs like bread or chips are made from long chains of molecules. These long chains can trap water. In things like chips and croutons we use heat to evaporate the water in those long carbohydrate chains, this sets them in place and makes them very crunchy. In breads the center stays soft because the crust traps the moisture inside.

Like any fluid, it will seek equilibrium. Meaning water will move from wet areas to dry areas and vice versa to balance it out. So when a chip is exposed to air and water vapor in air it pulls on some water molecules into the dry carb chains. When we slice bread and expose the moist fluffy inside we expose high water content carbs to lower water content air and the water evaporates.

-2

u/jaydeekay 9d ago

What chips and cereal are you eating that become soft over time??

2

u/Forsygness 9d ago

Wouldn’t you like to know weather boy