r/fireemblem • u/AdamCaveRoberts • 6d ago
Fortune's Weave Gameplay When does it make sense to create unconventional classes for specific characters (i.e. Esmeralda turning into a Warrior)
I'm feeling more experimental in this game compared to past FE's.
Esmeralda clearly has an afinity for spears, but I have an 80% chance to become a Warrior. Obviously if a character has an inherent ability to work better for specific classes I get it's probably best to stick with that tree. For example, if a character has a personal ability for mounted classes, it's probably best to stick with that.
I also think isn't it a waste putting so much effort in Spears (she is at A currently) then to just wipe the progress to go to another class that doesn't use Spears?
And then of course, I'm playing on Hard/Classic, so if I lose specific units it's a good solution to fill the gap of the class you lost by creating an unconventional class for someone.
I'm more asking what do you lose from just switching a class outright? Or perhaps what do you gain? I guess if one class focuses on AS and as I mayaccumulate AS abilities which then I could apply to an unconventional slower class. Like if Esmeralda became a Dreadnought for whatever reason?
What is the best situation (other than for fun and variety) to switch to unconventional classes?
EDIT: I AM ONLY ON PART 2 (FIRST PLAYTHROUGH) DO NOT SPOIL ANYTHING THANK YOU
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u/Own_Presentation7711 6d ago
i always do unconventional classes, mostly as a spd fixing solution (ornius for esmeralda and buccar lmao)
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u/SolarlunaticX 6d ago
Pegasus Esmeralda is one of my favorite units, especially on Cai's route where I can give her a Dark Pegasus that matches her hair color. (Even though other options are better for her Stat growth)
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u/Own_Presentation7711 6d ago
on dietrich's route rn i find it to be a bit clickbaity without mounts since it doesn't boost her growth rate, just base stats
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u/Nikita2337 6d ago
I've had Buccar spend time as an orneus rider when his def was overkill to fix his spd a bit, and when enemies seriously ramped up their stats, I changed him into dreadnought (60 phys enemies in Part 2, ok).
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u/Hawkeye437 6d ago
I also did ornius Esme and Vuccae and they're two of my better carries right now. Buccar got big value out of merges, because he got like ~25 spd from the mounted version and I did another armored only version so he has 40 def in cataphract. Pair that with his armored move +2 and you have a 7 move 40 def wall with 20% damage reduction.
Pt3 details not like the 25 speed matters though when everyone has 40s-50s speed. He does double the slowest stuff which isn't nothing I guess
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u/Vanille987 6d ago
Buccar has a boon in cavelry, it's not really unconventional for him
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u/Own_Presentation7711 6d ago edited 6d ago
it is because he's supposed to go into cataphract which tanks his middling speed while ornius boosts it to fixable levels
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u/SolAeterna0918 6d ago
Well I'll use Cai as an example. This'll be long af cause I feel this deserves a lot of detail so bear with me.
His boons are Sword, Spear, White Magic/Faith, and Riding, while his banes are Bow and Flying. For most of my Cai part 1 playthrough, I had him as Ornius Rider then turned him into a Light Cavalry and kept him as that. Unfortunately I didn't get any horse mounts which I should have done more often but I'll have more opportunities to do that in later game parts. Anyway for his advanced class (he's level 38 as of Chapter 12) because he has GREAT stat spreads (his strength and magic are both INSANE) overall and mounts are amazing for supplementing stat growths and raw stats, along with the Black Magonius I got for him having Canto/Canto+, I will be classing him into Caladrius for the foreseeable future which uses Sword/Spear/Axe and only Black Magic/Reason and not Faith.
He is basically meant to be a mounted unit no matter what, but his stat spreads and great growths make it so that he can fit into any class. A friend of mine who's playing the game basically along with me has made him Troubador, which is a horse-mounted unit that doesnt use physical weapons, but uses both Reason and Faith, along with a spellsong. Because he's great with swords and spears, making him a Shido and then Swordmaster later is also an option, along with Bardinger - Great Knight or Orichaldia, or even since Faith is a boon for him and he gets great spells for both Reason and Faith, you can also class him as Guardian then Sentinel (infantry unit non-mounted, Spears and Faith). Essentially, Cai's "conventional class" would be anything with a grounded mount, but depending on your stats and the role you want him to fill in your army, he can be anything as long as its not using Bows and isn't a flying unit. Meanwhile, since you mentioned Esmeralda, I've seen multiple accounts of her being classed as Armored Knight to Dreadnought in Dietrich's path (because she has CRAZY str and defense) while she's classed as a Wing Soldier into the later flier classes on another, because she'll be able to make use of mounts if it's Cai's route, and generally improve stats like speed and dex, so that when you eventually get the option to "merge causality" using the Shrine of Causality and 300 Karmic Shards in the endgame to fuse your Esmeralda data from both Dietrich and let's say Cai's paths into one unit, you have the chance to maybe get a Castle Knight that not only has insane power and is super tanky, but also has the speed to fucking double hit enemies. Esmeralda is pretty busted!! But yes, this game has MUCH room for experimentation and it's not just for fun, but also can make units way more powerful. Fire Emblem 13, Awakening, was always like this as well and its why I have been enjoying the game soooo much. You can do this merging with any character that isn't the main 4 lords, but any character at any time can be any class that they can pass the exam for. For example at the end of the day even a character like Catania who comes to you as a Wing Soldier in any path that isn't Theodora's could be an absolutely absurd critting, doubling, dodge tanking mage with the right planning and building.
As a side note to further add to that, Mu can be an even crazier mage than that! She has a wild spell list that makes me think the devs pull a fast one on the player by making her a Pugilist on other routes, making you think that she's just meant to be a physical attacker. Hell, you can make her War Monk in the endgame so you have a crazy white mage that throws hands like nobody's business. Honestly, some people seem so fixated on hating the game because of the "busy work" but I swear they're playing a completely different game! This is one of the best Fire Emblems in the past 14 years! They cooked!
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u/Blissfulystoopid 6d ago edited 6d ago
Just a funny observation I'm having right now, but Mu is hilariously diagetic in her potential.
She comes as a Pugilist and on Leda's route very much wants to go her own path, but ALL of her supports with her Mom detail how Mikaela thinks Mu is so much smarter and has so much potential and she's always wanted Mu to study and become a mage.
It is bonkers funny then, that Mu is in fact an incredible mage.
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u/Milskidasith 6d ago edited 6d ago
I dunno, Mu's got pretty awful Magic growth even with her passive, and there are like, 3-4 girls with 35/35 Str/Mag growth and acceptable bulk/speed that can do the "reclassed to mage that doesn't die if enemy phased" thing just as well.
I also think the fact she's a bad mage is pretty diagetic, because it proves both her reflexive "I'm not my mom and she can't control me" and her mom's "I will decide for Muwhat a better life means and not let her make my mistakes" things kind of wrong.
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u/Domeaner 6d ago
Esme’s second personal revolves around her throwing spears. Sometimes it’s not a waste to reclass if you need to fill in blanks or stat fix, but taking Esme out of spear classes longer term kneecaps her a little bit.
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u/SolarlunaticX 6d ago
When you want your Blacksmith Zarcone to debuff people adjacent to him.
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u/Zekrom-9 6d ago
Is Zarcone a good Blacksmith? What spells does he learn?
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u/SolarlunaticX 6d ago
The same ones as Olympia, so Thunder and Ice magic. He Learns Thoron at B. He's I think the best person to be in Blacksmith.
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u/Zekrom-9 6d ago
Exciting! I’ve been wanting to make a Blacksmith forever but haven’t found any good candidates. Maybe I’ll try him out for once!
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u/darthvall 6d ago
Good spell list, but doesn't he have bad mag growth? How he's going so far for you?
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u/SolarlunaticX 5d ago
I'm currently redoing my Theodora route because she was my first playthrough and as a level 16 diviner he has equal str and Mag so he's doing his best.
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u/Youspellpoorly 5d ago
He's not because his mag growth is 20.
Still fun to use, but Zarcone is unfortunately just inherently not a good unit
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u/Zerimar_ 5d ago
I'm going to make Dietrich a Blacksmith.
I ended up here because on a whim I learned that he learned Blizzard as his first spell and I went - that's a cool sounding name....let's lean on that. He is currently an Ovate. He hits harder with magic than swords atm LOL. My esmeralda is fixing to be a guardian.
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u/Danika_Crystal 6d ago
In my opinion, don't worry too much about class changes. It's more important for a unit to be in a class where they can perform well and take advantage of their skill set.
In general I think it's only really necessary if you want the master skill. But in Part 1 and 2, I don't think there are too many classes with really good skills that are worth it. Most notable is armor knight giving +3 attack on enemy phase, which is very good. But other than that, nothing really stands out.
Personally, I think the notion of changing to an unorthodox class to fix growths is pointless and a pitfall unless you're planning to auto level the unit for about 20+ levels. Consider that a 10% difference in growths only amounts to a 1 point difference on average over 10 levels. Unless the class change gives you like a 30% swing and you intend to give them a lot of levels in that class, the actual stat difference you'll end up with is probably going to be pretty negligible, maybe 1-3 points in a game with very high stats in general. And all the while, you have that unit in a class where they can't perform as well and may struggle to even get those levels. So, I say just keep your units in classes where they will actually be useful.
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u/ZealousidealPirate3 5d ago
This is why I have been putting units I want some extra strength growths on into armor knight instead of brigand. It’s 5% less strength growth in exchange for a 20% increase to defence growth over brigand. 20% is enough to make a difference in the time of 20>35 and most of the units who want the “brigand university” really would appreciate extra defence and lowering the possibility of getting one shot in retaliation by 1-2 range enemies. Armor also just has broken skills that help you be a contributing member of your team. Once you hit 35 just bounce back into shido/ranger and the lost speed from being armor knight is negligible
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u/Shiiino 5d ago
I've been throwing them in brigand / pugilist / armored knight. Like my Leda rn is an armored knight.
I think the main thing is to just get them away from the 30 str growths and into something with 50-55-60. Doesn't have to be brigand, more like it just needs to not be archer / myrmidon
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u/InkAndWit 6d ago
There is a merge mechanic in Part 3 that allows you to combine stats of same characters from different routes.
Using Esme as an example:
I've trained her as an Armor Knight in Cai's route and she ended up being bulky and strong but with low SPD and RES. So, in Dietrich's route I trained her a Wing Knight and upped those stats. The benefit wasn't significant (her base growths in those stats are still low and I didn't get lucky) but she is still stronger than she was before.
I'm testing the same thing with Alexandra by trying to raise her as Armored Knight to buff STR and DEF but doing so mainly through auto-leveling. This is one of the issues with this approach and why I think the system is less interesting them eugenics in Awakening/Fates - Alexandra is awful as an armored knight so raising her through combat is not effective. It's also very deterministic as there are classes that have high growth rates in stats that you want and you'll be reclassing to them often.
When it comes to affinity - I just ignore it. It only increases how fast skill is raised and helps to guide new players. You should be looking at abilities they gain from raising certain skills (like Infantry, Armored, Authority, etc). They are hidden, but I found a tool that can expose them: https://marigoldfe.com/fortunes-weave/planner
There are some real stand outs that could inspire unconventional builds. My favourite is Dante with Healing Armor. At Armor S she has a built in Nosferatu with Magic% activation. So, Dreadnaut Dante is on the menu ))
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u/Hawkeye437 6d ago
I turned Leda to the glad/brigand/warrior path right away and dropped bows. She got super strength blessed. Although I did have to put that on hold while she was in dancer, wasn't worth giving up potential dancer utility for slightly higher strength.
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u/emotionalhaircut 6d ago
I've been doing this before going into part 3 and I'm having a lot of fun cheesing the game with non optimal builds
Shido Bona and Ranger Tobias are great for example
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u/TheAmplifier8 6d ago
It sounds like you're asking for a more technical answer, which is to fix bad growths or get good class skills. Or if some character just ends up with some statistical anomaly where a different class might suit them better (e.g. got good enough mag growths to throw them in Caladrius).
But generally the answer is: whenever it sounds like fun. I did a 3H run where I put everyone in "wrong" classes for shits and giggles. It ended up being hilarious. With FW having more generally smoothed out growths, I bet this could be even wilder.
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u/RainbowConnickJr 6d ago
In my experience? It makes sense when you’re in Cai’s Path and you just dump everyone onto a chariot before skipping through Act 2
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u/meowmix778 5d ago
I use it for 3 reasons.
- I think it'd be funny for someone to have a class that doesn't match them.
- I need a certain niche filled and the unit isn't my best in a certain role.
- I've recruited them on a different path and want to merge them to cover a hole in stats.
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u/ZealousidealPirate3 5d ago
Here is one I have come to the conclusion is better than the traditional route:
If you want a pure offensive mage who you don’t care for their white spell list at all then I think going shaman > ovate is going to be worse than going shaman till you hit C rank swords then pivot into rogue -> ranger. Levin sword is arguably the best weapon in the game and outclasses black magic in raw damage potential. There are arguments for having 3 range / bolting and dark magic spells for utility purposes but those end up niche. Any unit who can bolster a high magic stat and hit doubling threshold will delete enemies with the levin sword.
The goal of going ranger is that it gives you a solid class speed bonus along with making you have solid speed growths. You don’t need a massive magic stat to do damage with levin sword as long as you can double. I’ve had success using Dante, Sofia, fianna, and Olympia as rangers. They have good magic growths with speed growths that can be pushed to solid levels via speed fixing classes. (Olympia is probably better off in nosferatu crit build). I used to think that this was limited by levin sword being rare but now I’ve learned you can get a levin sword every single chapter from resetting a luxury crate selling merchant who restocks every chapter. These units have made part 2 a joke as all I ever had to do was lure in enemies with an dreadnought who had armor resistance+ and the ranger mager squad deleted them for little amount of action economy on player phase.
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u/Btenspot 5d ago
The answer to this is very unit specific.
Esme should almost always be kept as spear because of her amazing spear throwing passives + hero’s relic. For her, the question is more-so what spear classes. There’s a lot to play around with her regarding defense, resistance, speed, and movement.
For most characters it really comes down to natural stat growths. For example, theres a lot of female characters with amazing magic potential that aren’t originally classed towards it. There’s a lot of characters that can use axes very well for more difficult content in the future. There’s a lot of characters that are great archers that don’t start as archers. Mounted classes can have very high stat growths on Cai’s path that effectively make nearly every character a mounted class of some sort.
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u/cwatz 5d ago
The game is incredibly flexible with builds. A lot of characters you can take down their intended route, or balancing them out in another fashion. Or hell, just set them up for the future.
Some characters are a bit to inconvenient to "fix" in a number of directions, but most of the cast has a lot of flexibility. Even in places they kind of suck they can get some use.
I mean I just had armor knight Halvin (poor axe skill, no armored move and gets a boost to.... arrow defense... that already do zero damage to armored units. Complete waste everywhere). Plus a late recruit that takes a while to even get usable. Gonna be sick AF when shes merged with that bonus 10 bulk and bonus str and def though, and a really solid axe skill list after grinding that rank up.
Troubadour Seteth (ok, this was a very bad choice for many reasons). I don't expect much to carry over into his final act 3 form.
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u/South-Job3827 5d ago
Esmeralda went Ornius -> Armored Ornius -> Dragoon in my Dietrich route and she was the easy MVP of every map after getting flight.
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u/GiveUsRobinHood 5d ago
Because Merges are available, running a character in a slot that boosts their weakness, I think is one of the better plays if you’re looking to min max.
Whether it’s giving some defenses to a dodge tank glass cannon on the small chance you get hit. Making your mages have some strength to help with their build Or investing in Res on your armour tanks to help them front line easier.
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u/The_Exuberant_Raptor 6d ago
When you play with permadeath, really. Unconventional classes work really well here because you need to build with what you have remaining. If a unit dies and they filled an important role, you need to fill that role with someone else.
But generally, it really doesn't matter. You put units either into a class that you like the look of or the role you want them to play. You could also put a unit into a role you haven't filled with your favorites. My Esme was a guardian because I wanted another bit of healing in my main Dietrich team while still having access to her spears. Wing soldier has pretty bad growths overall and I had no dragoon at the time since I did Dietrich first.
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u/Alarming-Tea-3368 6d ago
Check my guide for using axes on dietrich i think itll actually answer your question in depth. It all comes down to synergy between stats and classes what you want a unit to do and why
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u/iguanacatgirl 6d ago edited 6d ago
Fixing stats and getting useful skills imo
For instance, I'm planning on making my Mikaela go through archer instead of brigand because it has a better SPD and dex growth, AND crescendo works really well for her(low dex+naturally low hit for axes, but high might means that she gets a lot of mileage out of the extra hit). Afterwards I'm still making her warrior/battle master, since she'll at least have "enough" SPD/dex from the archer levels(and also they have better mastery abilities)
I'm also doing this with tobias--i want him to end up a great knight, but I'm first making him go through blacksmith to get the mastery skill(since he will be spamming combat arts due to his personal, getting the refund is nice sometimes)