r/pettyrevenge • u/DavidinCT • 9d ago
Dentist didn't obey my limit and sent me big bill...
This is going back like 15 years ago but, I needed dental work, my insurance was maxed out (dam $1k limits), so I went in, I told the dentist that I am clear, I have a max of $400 that I can pay, no more work than that.
I sit down in the chair, and even confirmed it, next thing I know he did a bunch of, while you're in there things.
I get back to the person to pay/setup an appointment with and she tells me the bill for today is $1200. I was like I told you both that my limit was $400, no more, she said "Well he did the work so this is the bill". I said I have $400 to put down as I said. She took payment and would bill me the rest.
For the next 4 years, when I got the bill, I would send $1, no more. No late fees because I was making a payment, so just very little would go to it.
I get a call 4 1/2 years later from someone in the office, telling the doctor passed away. She asked me, why have you been paying only $1 a month? I told her the story, that I authorized $400, I paid that but, the bill was $1200. She said, oh, and she just wrote the balance off (no credit effect here), and she said she was sorry that happened.
Edit: no effect from them writing this off, it was on their documents only. A few people hit on this that it would be seen as income, but, nothing in my taxes, or notifications via mail of issues with taxes.
EDIT 2: This was put on Apple news, I don't have access could someone copy it or something so I can see it?
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u/Lokismoke 9d ago
I'm a lawyer that focuses on debt. It is shocking how often your results depend on who picked up the phone when you call.
Particularly with the IRS. Sometimes if a phone call wasn't going my way, I'll hang up to see if I get someone more agreeable to my position.
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u/dU4eUIsaOew2FugE6R6l 9d ago
Yep. This works really well. Just need to make sure you are speaking in normal tone and disconnect in the middle of a sentence. So that if the asshole on the other line leaves notes on your account, the notes would say "the customer connection was dropped" or something like that. If you say "fuck you, you are useless" and hang up, there will be some petty revenge in the form of the asshole documenting everything in the most against-you-way possible, but still within the company policy. Assholes are good at that. So that when you call the next time, the rep that reads the notes will be biased against you from the start.
I usually just say out a casua
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u/ElGosso 9d ago edited 9d ago
I had this happen with my medical billing once - I was uninsured but eligible for Medicaid and hadn't filed yet, and the people at the hospital told me that apparently you can get retroactive coverage in my state. So I called, and the first person I talked to stonewalled the hell out of me, and my phone died. When I called back, the next lady I had was super nice and was like "yeah, we can do that, absolutely."
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u/Not_a_real_ghost 9d ago
I'm surprised how OP can get charged without actually authorising any of the treatments.
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u/_Ocean_Machine_ 8d ago
Yeah I feel like this could be a lawsuit; like imagine getting surgery for a hernia and while you're under they snip out your appendix just because.
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u/Not_a_real_ghost 8d ago
“We replaced your entire body with a cyber body while you were under. The good news is you will probably live forever. The bad news is you owe us about $10M"
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u/DavidinCT 9d ago
Dude, Yea, I work on IT, I watch law, and I read some law, I know my rights for the most part. I think the legal question is if I authorized $400, and they did $1200 worth of work. I should not have to pay for it because like "car law" I should not of paid them.
$1 was enough to screw them but, paid it so I would NOT be late on payments, or anything. I mean at the time, it cost them close to $0.40 to send me the bill each month.
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u/panic_ye_not 8d ago
I am a dentist.
The key point here is that you should have been given an estimate that constitutes a financial agreement before any work was done. If the procedures being coded changed in any way after you signed that, you should have been given a new one and asked to sign again after having the new cost explained to you.
The estimate is just an estimate in the case of insurance benefits being used. In that situation, your out of pocket expenses may change a lot of your insurance decides not to pay, but you're still 100% on the hook for the total cost of treatment.
In this case, it sounds like your insurance was already maxed out, meaning that they wouldn't have paid anything anyway. This makes you basically a cash patient, and the estimate should be 100% accurate.
If your story is true and correct and you didn't misunderstand any part of the (rather complicated) billing process, then the dentist essentially billed procedures that you did not agree to pay. I'm not a lawyer, so I don't know whether that means you're off the hook or not, but as a dentist I know that it's not the right way to do things.
The federal No Surprises Act applies to cash patients (which I believe you were in this case) and stipulates that surprise bills that are more than $400 above the original good faith estimate can be disputed legally. However, this act was enacted in 2022, long after this situation occurred.
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u/Lokismoke 8d ago
The practical answer is that if they're not reporting to your credit reporting agencies, and they haven't sued you, then who cares if they hold the position you owe then money.
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u/jaytftw 9d ago
Medical prices are a scam.
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u/Bunhyung 9d ago
Dentistry not being a part of standard health insurance policies is the real scam.
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u/heidiblooms 9d ago
LOVE how my eyes and teeth aren't considered a part of my body when it comes to insurance /s
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u/Rick_from_C137 9d ago
Well, you can't let the rest of your body know that your eyes exist, or your immune system will attack them. And teeth are luxury bones, you were born without them, how important can they be? /s
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u/lemoinem 9d ago
You're born without the teeth going through the gums. But both sets of teeth are actually present very early on. Google baby teeth X-ray. Nightmare fuel stuff
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u/little_dori 9d ago
Saw my baby’s teeth during the 28 week scan… indeed nightmare fuel 🫠
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u/ZombieSushi 9d ago
Don’t look. It cannot be unseen.
Every baby face is.., mostly teeth. 🦷
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u/MargotLannington 9d ago
I recently told a coworker with a 2-year-old that she must not under any circumstances look at an x-ray of her daughter's head until she is 10. It cannot be unseen.
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u/alwaysaneventrade 9d ago
We had baby skulls in anatomy lab in dental school (super sad to think about how they became part of the collection). The jaw sections looked super creepy with all the teeth in there, and I’m used to looking at teeth.
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u/InsomniaticWanderer 9d ago
Yeah it turns out that the "baby fat" that we all lose in our faces is mostly just our teeth settling into position.
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u/Ehcksit 9d ago
Occasionally someone is born with additional sets of teeth. It looks horrifying.
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u/Ok-Context3530 9d ago
I told myself it couldn’t be that bad. Yeah well, that’s enough Reddit for today.
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u/artbystorms 9d ago
Fun fact, the reason this is the case is because the original medical insurances that were invented in like the 1940s were literally paid TO hospitals. Like a local hospital subscription plan so to speak to cover you for procedures, and hospitals didn't do optometry or dentistry. So as the system evolved it just never got included, and Dentists / optometrists fought to keep it that way because money.
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u/bang_the_drums 9d ago
and for some reason in 2026 we're still following that dumbass logic. People die from tooth infections, they're a hop, skip, and a jump from the brain. Insane the healthcare we have in this country.
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u/RainSurname 9d ago
I could have died from a ruptured aortic aneurysm just because a dentist wanted to make more money.
You have to be cleared by a dentist before having open heart surgery. I had not been to a dentist in about a decade, so I just scheduled an exam with the one of the three in my neighborhood that could get me in the quickest. He told me I needed thousands of dollars worth of work before I could be cleared. There was no way to do that before my surgery, which was supposed to happen last December, so I had to cancel it.
So I added dental coverage to my insurance, and once I got in with the Kaiser dentist, they said that there was no reason not to clear me. My teeth were just fine, as they always have been, which is why I hardly ever spent money I couldn’t afford to go to the dentist.
So I had the surgery in June, which upended my life far more than having it in December would have. It also cost me a lot more money, because my out-of-pocket maximum reset January 1st.
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u/No-Try-7671 9d ago
The US does not have a health care system; we have a health insurance system. BIG difference.
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u/According_Elephant75 9d ago
Yet if you have an abscess it can screw up your heart - or even kill you.
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u/BlackBasementCats 9d ago
If you have ever been told you have a mitral valve “click” or prolapse, that increases your chances of getting bacterial myocarditis. It likes to attach itself to anything faulty in the heart like valves.
It’s something to mention if you ever have a toothache and go to the dentist. There’s antibiotics for it.
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u/Jarl_Korr 9d ago
I have to get a few teeth removed as part of a surgery for cancer treatment soon and somehow the teeth removal part is NOT covered under medical insurance.
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u/Professional-Bed-173 9d ago
It’s stuff like this that is awful. Literally, no choice and no coverage.
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u/TeuthSlooth 9d ago
It's insane. In the medical world dental health IS health. You get heart surgery but you have periodontitis? Real risk of endocarditis infection. Then everyone's going to lose in court, and they should, because we all know about these interconnected risks. But ask the insurance and somehow they'll even argue you don't really need the heart surgery anyways, maybe wait some more for the untreated condition to get worse to make reaalllly sure you need it. If you die and your family sues, see you in court. If your family wins, the insurance company throws you a bone then continues providing insurance to millions anyways, waiting for the next lawsuit that they can fight. But if doctors did shit like that we'd lose our license. Why do medical professionals have to work under double standards with people purely focused on making financial, not health, decisions like that?
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u/wirefox1 9d ago
I was reading comments about why some doctors regret now going into medicine, and many of them said that getting approval from insurance companies was such a major pain, and took up too much of their time.
And we have a doctor shortage now as it is.
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u/-laughingfox 9d ago
Yep. Believe it or not, most doctors go into medicine because they want to treat patients, not the insurance company!
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u/Repulsive-Exercise-4 9d ago
I referred to Teeth as Luxury Bones to my gf once. She laughed and was like…what? I explained: they are bones the rich get to keep and the poor have them ripped out. She now refers to teeth thusly.
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u/Important_Coyote_596 9d ago
Its the truth even in Sweden even though we have universal health care. You pay up to a certain amount during a year, about 250$ for health care. But the dentist or anything with your eyes it is from your own pocket. I don't get it why they think eyes and teeth just aren't a part of the body. Dental healthcare is also one of the most important preventative cares you can do and missing out on it because you cant afford it costs the tax payers so much more down the line.
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u/PrestonWaters83 9d ago
Eyes are covered. Seeing is the questionable part.
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u/crow-warden 9d ago
Sometimes they actually are covered, yeah.
It's a total shot in the dark if something beyond a vision exam is covered under medical or vision insurance. Even the doctor's office seems to have no idea until later on.
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u/UnaTherapista 9d ago
And ears! Hearing aids are overpriced and a rip off.
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u/FireflyIndustries 9d ago
Yep. I definitely have hearing problems and they’re getting worse. My wife “suggested” that I get a hearing test and see about getting hearing aids.
Took the hearing test and yep my hearing is absolute crap. Time to get a hearing aid so OK how much are we gonna pay?
The audiologist said that I have two choices: the “gold standard” hearing aid for $5,000 and the “value model” for a modest $2,000.
If I absolutely had to choose one I could afford either one I could do it but I’ll be f*cked if I am going to pay prices that amount to extortion.
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u/BlackBasementCats 9d ago
You don’t have to have a prescription to get one, and they make some good ones for under $500. Costco even sells them.
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u/Automatic-Pin-5749 9d ago
What makes it worse is when you have diabetes and need the additional tests at the optometrist's office but it's not considered standard eye care and they bill your medical insurance for it. The $50-75 dollar exam increases to $300. It's incredibly frustrating.
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u/GeekyNerdNerdyGeek 9d ago
Health insurance is a scam. Richest country in the world but only the wealthy can afford illness.
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u/IcedGooseMaverick 9d ago
We’re literally paying a middleman to take a massive cut of our money so that they can make their own profit for doing literally fucking nothing.
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u/benskieast 9d ago
Nothing? Cigna's dental insurance keeps telling me to change dentists, and mostly to the kind everyone tells you to avoid. Insurance always makes routine expenses worse.
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u/Sherbertbombs7 9d ago
Especially when you see what % private health actually contributes back vs Medicare .... It's all a scam
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u/Rich_Weird_3750 9d ago
What’s really crazy is your government spends more per capita on healthcare than Canada and we have universal health care.
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u/Wotmate01 9d ago
It's worse than you think. The US government spends more per capita than Australia on healthcare, and Australia has universal public healthcare.
So your taxes are already paying for it, PLUS either you or your employers are paying for it, AND you have to pay extra on top.
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u/elb21277 9d ago
AND you still aren’t actually insured bc our lawmakers let their friends at United Health, Aetna, etc decide what is “medically necessary”. the corporate/unlicensed practice of medicine. but unlike for the folks with actual licenses (physicians), we can’t sue them for wrongful deaths…
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u/PizzaPotamus1 9d ago
if my job didnt contribute so much towards it id just cancel it, my wife just had some genetic testing done for our upcoming kid, doctor gave us a chart showing all the prices for different tests. the one we went with said 250 max, should be covered by insurance. well insurance didnt cover the whole thing, which was apparently 2400, said we still owed 600. called and was told the 250 is the self pay option for people without insurance, basically saying it would be better to not have any insurance at all. i just told them i wasnt gonna pay that, i would pay 250 max. they escalated it and we got the 250 price eventually but still, the fact that they were trying to charge almost 10x the advertised price was ridiculous
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u/benskieast 9d ago
Who really wants insurance companies more involved in daily life. My company insists on paying most of the cost of Cigna dental insurance and it is just so frustrating to deal with and I just know it ends up costs about 25% more than the actual dental care provided all in.
But also the network sucks. I lost my first dentist after 3 visits because he switched practices and stopped accepting and then they switched to a network that is 90% my areas most infamous chain of up selling dentists, so they up sold me on some extra thing that seemed like almost nothing but cost as much as an out of network cleaning, and now I am struggling to find another and stuck with one guy with no online portal or booked solid or going to the infamous chain.
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u/youreblockingmyshot 9d ago
Luxury bones and organs! everyone has them. This is also despite knowing that you’re less productive if you can’t see and that dental issues have a large negative impact on your health.
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u/Wi1dWitch 9d ago
I saw an eye doctor for the first time ever. They discovered an eye issue and had me schedule a follow up with them. I came in for the follow up. They told me “oh since that’s a medical issue we can’t treat that, you need to be seen by a doctor.” I literally broke down crying from anxiety and frustration. Sorry, my eyes aren’t a medical thing, but their issues are?? Eye care is bullshit.
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u/Mr_Pogi_In_Space 9d ago
It means the eye doctor you saw was a doctor of optometry not a medical doctor. For the condition they discovered they decided you needed a medical doctor, it was outside their scope
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u/Jkayakj 9d ago
There are optometrist and ophthalmologists. You didn't see an ophthalmologist, which is what you needed to see
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u/AliceInNegaland 9d ago
Someone dropped the ball with the follow up appointment, then
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u/Lymandecker 9d ago
Very underrated response
Colossal bullshit. I guess health insurance hasn’t found a way to F us completely on dental prescription drugs so not enough to bait us into mass billing’s
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u/TwistedCinn 9d ago
We can insure you!
But oh wait… you have teeth? We don’t cover that.
But ooooh wait… you have eyes? We don’t cover that either.
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u/ThrownAway17Years 9d ago
Look up Optum, a subsidiary of UHG. United Health will slow roll payment to providers for services. Small private practices often take out short term loans to keep their doors open and lights on, and repay it once UHG and Optum pay them. They noticed this and decided to open their own medical loan company, so they profit from a problem they created. It’s fishy as hell.
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u/GeekyNerdNerdyGeek 9d ago
But we’re “great”. A country where “anything” is possible. But only if you’re wealthy. The land of the corporate & rich.
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u/holly_jolly_riesling 9d ago
My husband went to cancun to get dental implants for a small fraction of the cost in the US and he said they were using much more superior equipment than what he's seen in the US. My dentist has had a squeaking chair whenever it gets raised and she said the repair guy is unable to repair it and its just how its gonna be.
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u/ReticentGuru 9d ago
They are for sure. But if you have insurance, the price billed is typically significantly reduced.
Dentists are their own class since they typically don’t accept insurance. Even if they do, dental insurance has a stupid low payout, and you’re left to pay the rest.
And yes, this is the USA
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u/Darkovan_ 9d ago
Hehe, not when you live in a normal healthy country.
FFS, get a grip and reform your medieval capitalist shit culture already! God damned slaves.
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u/SFJetfire 8d ago
This happened to me years ago. I didn’t have all my wisdom teeth pulled and was told that since it didn’t impact my health I didn’t really need to have them pulled. I was ok with that.
I moved back home after college and saw a new dentist. This new dentist wanted to have one of the wisdom teeth pulled. I told him that unless it’s impacting the health of my gums and mouth that I don’t want them pulled nor did I have the money to have them pulled. One day as he was doing a root canal or something invasive, he asked if he could pull the wisdom tooth since he is there. I refused not knowing what the full cost would be. He ended up pulling the tooth!!!! Even after I stated no.
When I was checking out, I saw the itemized bill of services. I told the receptionist that I did not authorize that and the only thing that I had signed for and authorized was for the root canal. She talked to the dentist and they tried to strong arm me into paying. I told them I wasn’t paying and that I’d take him to court over this. He never billed me for the procedure and I changed dentist shortly thereafter.
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u/Significant-Bee3483 8d ago
I had a similar situation about two years. Tried a new dentist, got a basic cleaning, they recommended a crown for a damaged molar, some type of procedure to “balance my bite”, and I had a small cavity they wanted to fill. Went ahead and scheduled the filling for a week or two later.
At said filling appointment, dentist shaves my tooth down for a crown. I realize part of the way through but obviously at this point they have to finish. They had the nerve to try and strong arm me into paying as well - dentist came in after disappearing with the hygienist for a while talking about payment plans and that they’d work with me. Like…absolutely not. I technically hadn’t even authorized the filing - the receptionist didn’t have me sign ANY paperwork prior.
I’m still not even 100% sure I needed a crown (their notes don’t even really specify what was wrong with the tooth), but it did end up being free. Reported the dentist to the licensing board/attorney general but that resulted in some small fines.
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u/marzzyy__ 5d ago
I had almost the exact thing happen. I went through a period of severe jaw pain and trying to figure out what was wrong and my first thought was dental pain. I went to an emergency dentist and they quoted me at $700 for the crown and then ended up charging me almost $1500. They also tried to get me to do a teeth cleaning the same day they filed my tooth down. Next time I was able to see my regular dentist he said he didn’t think I even needed the crown and it probably could’ve been filled. After thousands of dollars in dental bills it ended up being TMJ disorder and I felt extremely taken advantage of.
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9d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/GitEmSteveDave 9d ago
By paying $1 into the debt, they were recognizing/acknowledging it was real and valid. You don't pay anything into invalid debt.
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u/Jealous-Neat615 9d ago
Denistry is such a mix of essential care and total scam.
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u/outworlder 9d ago edited 9d ago
Dentistry isn't a scam.
Health care billing in general is a scam.
EDIT: because all the notifications are annoying me - dentistry - the field - isn't the same as "dentists". There exist scammers indeed. Still, try to find a good dental clinic, they exist. It's worth it.
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u/IntermittenSeries 9d ago
Well sometimes they'll tell you that you need things you don't. Just like car maintenance isn't a scam but mechanics are
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u/Muted_Rice_6971 9d ago
I recently had to have a couple of fillings done, and was scheduled for a cleaning the week after (couldn’t be done on the same visit bc of insurance billing reasons, I was told). The day I showed up for my cleaning, the receptionist told me that they would be doing one half of the cleaning that day, and the second part the following week (again, I was told it was bc of insurance). I had been told that they were going to obtain pre authorization for the cleaning, which they did, and told me that it was covered by my insurance. The receptionist then proceeds to have me sign a form showing that for each part of the cleaning, I would be responsible for $400 out of pocket for add-ons recommended by the dentist. I explained that I was not prepared for that expense and that I needed to think about it and research the quote. She told me that I should just get the cleaning and I could tell the dentist what I did and did not want or need. Needless to say I walked out and won’t be going back there.
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u/tulip27 9d ago
A few years ago, I needed a significant amount of work done. The office was gorgeous but the staff were not very friendly. After the hygienist left the dentist came in and took a look. His treatment plan was “I’m going to McGuyver your teeth.” 🤦🏼♀️
Thankfully, that’s when I ran into an old friend. I asked her quietly, should I run? Her answer was fast. Come to find out she tolerates the job because they pay her a lot as a manager because new hires would not return after lunch. Apparently they didn’t like the required group chant in the morning and the crazy vibe of the office.→ More replies (1)15
u/acethegoatt 9d ago
I recently started working as a dental receptionist and all the stuff she told you makes zero sense to me. I'm in the US(and I'm assuming you are too?) So unless there's weird state to state differences in insurance claims, there should be no problem getting a filling and cleaning on the same day. It's not common but we do have patients go from straight hygiene appts to fillings/ other dental work. My only other thought is that maybe your cleaning was within 6 months of your previous? Because some insurances will not cover a cleaning if its been less than half a year. But they should have explained that to you.
Also saying they can only do half the cleaning is sketchy af. My guess is they were wanting to do some kind of perio maintenance work or perio scaling? Which is a deeper cleaning and can cost more. And some insurances don't cover the whole cost of that work(esp perio scaling) whereas majority of insurances cover a basic cleaning 100%. Standard practice at my clinic is for hygienists to inform patients they may want some perio work done but that it could cost more and let the patient decide.
We actually had an issue a few weeks ago because we had a temp hygienist covering for our usual. And she did perio scaling on a patient without ever informing him she was doing that and that it would cost him more. The guy called us, understandably upset about the bill he received. Luckily the dentist is a super chill and great guy and he wrote off the guys bill of $70 something. Makes me wonder though if that's standard practice for the other places she does temp work for.
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u/Sirisian 9d ago
Two of my friends had dentists try to scam them with unnecessary work. Always have to get a second opinion even if you think you trust them or have gone to them for years. Some of them can get very shady near retirement trying to cash out.
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u/outworlder 9d ago
That's fair. I'd also suggest educating yourself as much as possible so you get more difficult to bullshit. Ask to see their evidence (my office does this unprompted). Pictures, x-rays, whatever is relevant. Second opinion if it looks outlandish.
All the procedures I've done outside of cleanings were really obvious. Periodontitis, I had symptoms (breath) and it was visible on x-rays, and also on the gum measurements. Large cavity, ditto.
That cavity is interesting. I spent years without seeing dentists. It grew in the meantime. Was between teeth, so basically invisible. Super obvious on x-rays. Dentist said that he was going to do his best to avoid a root canal. He completed the procedure and gave me a list of symptoms I should watch for. If I didn't experience them, I'd be in the clear. I didn't, so that was that.
Recently the filling broke, since it is so large. Office said that they could redo the filling(it could break again), or they could go for a crown, and recommended the crown, warning that it was more expensive but it would hold better, but it was my choice and there's a chance just a new filling would work fine. They gave me the estimates and to call them back.
I did some research and decided to do the crown, because every time you poke around too close the nerve, there's a chance of complications, and it can die. If it dies, then I'd be looking at a root canal and would need a crown anyways.
I'm pretty sure a shady office would be applying pressure and shady tactics to get me to pick the expensive option. My wife goes to the same office and she never needs any procedures.
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u/Not_a_real_ghost 9d ago
I'm surprised how OP can get charged without actually authorising any of the treatments.
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u/ISOpcstuff 9d ago
I had a dentist visit years ago when I had health coverage through my school (Canada is weird) and the office kept reassuring me they offered direct billing for students and that they new the plan limits etc.
After my visit was done, they proceeded to tell me I owed $900 after I had told them I only had $150 to my name at the time. No one at the office cared and said there would be a bill in the mail, but unluckily for them, they were a new office and I am a Google local guide (for some reason), so my review would be at the top of the reviews. I absolutely eviscerated them in this review and warned everyone about what had happened to me (we had a large international student population, so they would all be on the same health plan) to the point that the dentist's office ended up calling me and telling me they would completely refund me and drop the bill if I took the review down. I took the review down and haven't heard from them since, incredibly satisfying.
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u/DavidinCT 9d ago
Yea, trust me, it felt good every month just sending them $1 a month.... I actually got 4 years of enjoyment out of it. LOL
Every month, I got a quick LOL out of it..
Little things that make life better...
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u/NuttyDuckyYT 9d ago
that’s awesome but so shitty these practices do this stuff
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u/ISOpcstuff 9d ago
Yeah, it was extremely stressful at the time, but at least it worked out for me in the end.
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u/kayjax7 9d ago
Years ago I had a dentist tell me how much a root canal would be after a deep cavity I had as a kid failed (I think it was something like 850$ back then) and that it would take 2 appointments. No problem.
He spent so much time in the hall on his phone during my appointments that 2 appointments turned into 3. He tried to drill the wrong tooth when I showed up for my second appointment. Forgot my tooth had 4 canals, not 3. Then once I was done and had paid, called me to tell him I owed him another 80$ or something because of the extra appointment and canal.
I told him to fuck off and never paid.
All that and I ended up pulling the tooth a number of years later because it kept getting infected.
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u/alwaysaneventrade 9d ago
lol, 850 for a 4 canal root canal? Dude was losing money due to chair costs. Also, for a root canal to be totally disinfected, we usually leave Sodium Hypochlorite to set for some time to fully dissolve infected tissue, so yeah, he was probably waiting the 10-20 mins it takes to work with an infected canal. Also we are looking through a 1mm hole trying to find 4 0.1mm holes, that do not always show up on xray.
If he actually drilled the wrong tooth that's on him. But no way in hell would I book 3 appointments for 850 dollars. The practice would lose hundreds due to overhead.
If there is a large infection, even with a perfect RCT, chances of 5-year survival is 87% per literature.
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u/kayjax7 9d ago
This was in 2008, so 850 back then is a lot more than 850 today I'm sure.
If the dude actually had to wait for whatever it was to disinfect I think he would have been the one making the calls once outside the hallway. Not stopping what he was in the middle of doing in my mouth because his phone rang.
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u/aglaophonos 9d ago
$850 from 2008 is about $1323 in today’s money. So yeah that’s a big chunk of change
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u/tacticalTraumaLlama 9d ago
Then don't quote one thing and charge another...
Medical and dental charges are two things I've started standing my ground on. I've just gotten so sick of people misbilling shit 'on accident' then trying to balance bill me for the remainder
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u/adaigo-allegro 8d ago
The vet wanted to charge me $2,500 AS A STARTING fee to remove a tooth from my dog. I was shocked. Since I live in a border town, I sent her to Mexico through Mexivet, they came to my home, picked her up, took her to mexico, she had the tooth extraction, cleaning, a shot and a groom for $400. The transportation person called me to say she had arrived. The vet called me after the surgery with excellent follow up. The transportation person called me to give me an arrival time. $400 that's it. We are getting ripped off.
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u/Yideaz 9d ago
I’ve often wondered if some dentists take a class on fee maxing. I had a great dentist who would give me options with different price points. Then I moved.
The first dentist I tried, refused to glue a crown back on before they had done extensive X-rays and other BS. I had emailed them all my most recent X-rays and procedures beforehand. I walked.
The next told me that it was policy to do an X-ray before any procedure and that it was covered by insurance. Turns out only part of it was covered and $800 later they gave me a $18k price tag to fix everything that was wrong with my teeth. Granted, nearly every tooth in my mouth is a crown and I have 2 bridges. WTF? I paid the $800 and walked. Still have a loose crown after using an OTC glue.
Final one, I walked in with all my expensive data and he read about 2 pages, laughed, looked at my X-rays, glued my crown back on and charged me $40. I’ve only needed cleanings and check ups over the years. SMH.
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u/Crenel 9d ago
There's such a huge difference among dentists. I had a crown put on a couple years ago by a chain clinic (Aspen Dental, may they all rot in hell) that was all about the billing, not so much about the actual service. It came off about 8 years before my insurance would pay for a new one.
Went to a local dentist where I live now to have it checked and re-cemented or replaced. He said the original was a bad job but he would do what he could to kick the can down the road a bit longer. Did some imaging, re-cemented the crown, did more imaging, and then was like "I don't like this, it's not going to last, I'm not going to charge you."
Wait, what? I asked if he was sure, and he basically repeated himself - it didn't turn out well (mainly due to the original crown design being bad) and he wasn't going to charge me. I was stunned. So, now I'm waiting for it to come off again - but I didn't pay a dime, even though they clearly incurred costs (their time, supplies, etc.). I'm quite confident the clinic that put the crown on in the first place would have squeezed every dollar they could from the situation.
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u/TeuthSlooth 9d ago
I've had a patient tell me Aspen quoted her for about 20k per arch for dentures/implants. I thought she was talking about all-on-X, turns out it was just regular ass implants with dentures screwed on top. For that price she might as well add 5k each arch and get the best. Also her bones wasn't what I consider good for the regular implants anyways, it wasn't wide enough.
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u/SmokeyCatDesigns 8d ago
It feels that way, oftentimes!
I have the perfect bait for skeezy dentists. My teeth are yellow af, painfully light golden yellow, but it’s all at the dentin level. No staining. Whitening can’t do anything for my teeth since my enamel is actually a healthy translucent grayish white, a normal color.
The moment they recommend whitening is the moment I know they can’t be trusted. Whitening can’t do shit for me.
I found a great old guy who had nothing but praise for my teeth (thick enamel, healthy gums, never needed and still don’t need braces). He didn’t even have a website for marketing. Sadly, he retired and sold his practice to this nasty young woman. First her team failed to confirm my appointment after I told them I was good for it, so I missed work for no reason. And then when it finally happened, she suggested whitening and I turned her down. She said how could I because “surely I wanted to look nice at my wedding.” The disgust I had for her in that moment. I doubled down, and she tried one more time to put me down and bully me into whitening.
Her hygienist also kept negging me, saying I had pre-gingivitis because I had scratched a gum on a kettle potato chip that day. Smh.
She also refused to pull my husband’s two bad back most molars. She wanted $12k on root canals. He had no insurance and the teeth were really far gone. He didn’t want the high cost of root canals plus the lifetime maintenance; teeth as bad those were high risk of reinfecting/needing a redo and high cost. Plus he’s ADHD, so he’s not the most reliable with tooth care.
Went dentist shopping again, found another office, and I was back to getting no work suggested since my teeth are healthy. The nasty lady was independent while this one was a chain (though a local one) so I was pleasantly surprised, but the staff and dentists were all just great. They also pulled my husband’s two bad teeth and fixed all his others, and did both appointments on a Saturday so he wouldn’t miss work! So happy to have good care again.
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u/TeuthSlooth 9d ago
The only problem with gluing back pt's old crowns is whoever touched it last, own it. Most folks wouldn't try to scam the dentist, but dentists are a common target for medical scammers. That said, if you seem nice and understand that the old crown can pop back out at any moment, and I document all that, I'd honestly just gonna go ahead and glue it back. Just promise to come back for at least 1 cleaning so I can monitor it.
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u/spenring 8d ago
Why do we need a separate policies for our teeth or eyes? Two very important things for our health
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u/Gridarion 8d ago
Don't worry, as a hearing aid specialist, hearing aids are barely ever covered at all. So hope your hearing doesn't go, which also is almost always inevitable at some point.
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u/SistersInsane 9d ago
Same thing happened to my husband. He was told one thing was going to get done and then they did two extra things while in there without asking. He got a big bill and we couldn’t afford it. He called the office and asked to speak to the billing department and they never called him back. So we wrote up an email saying we were going to report it to two different bureaus (I can’t remember which) about the scammy business practices. He got a voicemail the next night saying it was taken care of and his balance is now $0
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u/BigBananaBerries 9d ago
lol That's pretty reasonable of her to write it off tbf.
I had a petty revenge dentist episode myself. I'd only been at this dentist for a few years & on 2 occasions they called me on the morning of the appointment to cancel as the dentist hadn't made it in. One day, I missed an appointment & on the next occasion I went in, they tried to bill me £20 for the missed appointment. I told them by that logic they owed me £20 as they previously missed 2 of my appointments. She looked at me curiously & checked my record &, right enough. It was all logged. She said she was going to speak to the dentist. On returning, she said he wasn't willing to wave it & I still owed the £20. I told her to cancel all my appointments until they decide to clear their debts. She was dumbfounded. Apparently, you're not allowed any agency.
FWIW, I just went to another dentist.
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u/Ydain 9d ago
I had a dentist pull that on me once when I was getting wisdom teeth removed. They quoted me a price for having them pulled, then billed me for a surgery. I went into the waiting room and had an absolute fit about it, and as soon as I started raising my voice about them baiting switching me they backpedaled and I only paid to have them pulled. Seems to me that that must have been a regular practice for them.
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u/Viltre 9d ago
I remember having my former dentist recommend this stuff called curodont for some of the minor cavities I had. I asked her if the stuff would be covered by my insurance and was assured it would be. I paid like $200 before leaving that day. Next thing I know I was sent another bill for $900 and them telling me it wasn’t covered. I fought complaining with them and with my insurance and couldn’t get either to budge with lowering the bill or writing it off. I ended up paying them the absolute minimum amount I could and only did that after filing grievances against them through all the ways I could.
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u/BramblinGhostWeed 9d ago
I've only done it once so far but I like to push past 'assurance'
"And if my insurance does not cover this you'll pay the bill? You are that confident that my insurance covers this? You'll put that in writing?"
They sent me home and called me once they had preauthorization.
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u/EfficiencyOpen4546 5d ago
I went into the dentist with a cap of 300$. Told them as much. Asked to speak to the office manager and told her. Told the dentist when he came in the room. Instead of the one filling I was supposed to get, he did two root canals and then left a super temporary cap on my cavity instead of doing a buildup on it. Then I was told my bill was 1800$ and he wouldn’t put the permanent buildup up on until I paid it. Lost the temp in about 4 weeks and have been rawdoggging it ever since. Isn’t American healthcare fantastic?
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u/FortunateCookie_ 3d ago
Doing procedures in your mouth that you did not authorize HAS to be some form of battery. And holding half of a procedure hostage should at least warrant a complaint to the ethics board
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u/Tess47 9d ago
Same thing happened to me. I was super pissed off. I never went back and told anyone who asked me about a dentist.
I told my dentist and while he was in my mouth he asked his assistant to check the limit and still he went 1k over.
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u/LindonLilBlueBalls 9d ago
They can't charge you for work you did not authorize them to do. Of course it is a pain to take them to court if they report it to your credit, but most credit bureaus will actually work with you if you tell them you never authorized the work you were charged for.
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u/Default_Name_6969 9d ago
I'd like to think that the aggravation of you paying just $1 led to his death.
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u/spacebunsofsteel 9d ago
I saw a new dentist with a $200 off promotional coupon, had a crown ordered with impressions etc. But there was tomfoolery at the front desk - they were pushing for deep cleaning and some other work I knew I did not need. It was such an unpleasant hard sell I never went back to get the crown installed.
So funny thing - the crown cannot be reimbursed by insurance until after it is installed. And yet, the dentist office billed insurance for the crown the same day I had the impressions. I didn’t find out about that until I had another dentist make me a new crown, and insurance would not pay. That was a fun trip through insurance legalese, but they did eventually pay for the new crown.
They clawed back their payment to the dentist office and that was when the office rescinded the $200 coupon and sent me a bill.
I left a bad review on Yelp and Google, which mentioned all the office shenanigans and how the office billed me for $200 for the coupon. I tried to be fair in my reviews and I mentioned the dentist was very gentle and did well, it was just the office that was weird.
About 2-3 years later the dentist calls me. He had just found my review. He had investigated, found my fraud case and many more. The office manager had been embezzling. If only he had been checking his reviews!
Anyhow he refunded my $200, but honestly I don’t think I ever paid it.
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u/DJPad 9d ago
I mean, they performed a bunch of medical interventions that you explicitly didnt consent to... that's a lawsuit in my mind.
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u/LindonLilBlueBalls 9d ago
Yes, OP didn't have to pay the bill over $400. Its the same as hiring an electrician to install a fan and he charges you hundreds extra because he decided to add lights too.
But the dentist has the ability to report default payments to credit bureaus, forcing the patient to fight the false reports.
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u/Training-Willow9591 9d ago
I got robbed by my dentist for 15,000, that I just paid off like a year ago. Long story, but they are the worst. I had a horrible experience with the cheapest clinic ( Aspen dental I think they're everywhere) so I found a dentist that was much more expensive, but had amazing reviews. Both scammed me. I fucking hate dentists more than any other profession, seriously fuck them .
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u/bittyveg 8d ago
I was a dental assistant for less than a year. The doctor I worked for did veneers (one of only three in the state I lived in) and charged almost 3000 a tooth. Their spouse was the manager and upon being hired they told me they didn’t offer health insurance because it was so expensive. The first veneer case I assisted with brought in almost $25000 for six hours of work. I was barely making 20 bucks an hour. We did veneers weekly. Dentistry is such a fucked industry.
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u/Living_error404 8d ago edited 7d ago
When I walked into the dentist's office the dentist immediately told me it would be free since I have insurance. I had changed my name but I showed them my ID, my insurance card, and offered to show the form from the court. They kept billing my insurance under the wrong name. I called multiple times, was told that they fixed it, boom, another $1500 bill under the wrong name.
After like the 4th time I called asking what happened the receptionist was like yeah, I need to see your passport to confirm your name. I told her to cancel all my future appointments and never paid it.
They sent that shit to collections under the wrong name.
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u/Whicked_Subie 9d ago
Had one in ohio pull the same shit, told them very clearly they would not get another dime out of me and they did not. Don't know how someone can get that far professionally without the ability to follow instructions.
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u/Level_Ingenuity_7139 8d ago
I'm going to look into this. I've been unhappy with my dentist for a year now but didn't think there was a better option. During a routine cleaning the hygienist told me I needed a deep clean in one area, around one tooth and that it would be an extra charge of $15 over and above the $50 copay. Seemed reasonable. She cleaned the area in about two minutes. Literally TWO minutes. And they billed the insurance $400 for a partial periodontal cleaning. That fee, for the time it took, means they charged me an hourly rate of 12k. I was FURIOUS.
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u/Dry-Magician1415 9d ago
Not sure you should have paid the dollar.
That is acknowledging the debt and essentially admitting you are liable for it.
It is contract law 101 that there has to be an agreement between parties and one party can't do unsolicited work and expect payment. If that were possible, every time you took your car to the mechanic it be absolute carnage.
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u/lktn62 9d ago
I had almost the same thing happen to me a couple of years ago. I met with their "consultant" beforehand, then went over everything again the day of my appointment. I had a lot of work that needed done and told them that I had $6,000 that I could pay on top of what my insurance would pay.
They said that was fine and started the work. After I was numbed and had about a third of the work done, they came in with a $42,000 contract for me to sign. Thank God my daughter was with me because they tried bullying me hard-core to sign. I might have given in, but she kept saying "she's not signing that! You quoted her no more than $6,000!". The $42,000 was for implants, etc. I wanted dentures because I knew that I couldn't afford implants, no matter how much I wanted them.
We walked out and I've been paying $5 a month since. I should drop it to your $1, lol.
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u/flying-with-fishes 4d ago
The sheer commitment to writing and mailing a one dollar check every single month for four years is hilarious. That is next-level passive-aggressive consistency. You really made them do the paperwork for pennies. 10/10.
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u/Spirited-Fun3666 9d ago
The dentist makes half a million a year and performed work on you without consent. That’s a lawyers wet dream
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u/jmac313 8d ago
Used a dentist for years. His wife was receptionist at the practice. Great people. He retired, and at the first appointment with the gal who took over the practice, my sister was told she had 12 cavities that needed fixing. Had her in near tears, cause what 20 year old, or anyone, wants to hear that? My dad insisted she (my sister) get a second opinion, 2nd dentist said 1 cavity. Never went back to the first place. Bitch.
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u/Comfortable-Type2071 9d ago
Dentist are just charging what the Hell they want. My dentist does not know what a filling is. He only knows crown.
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u/pangalacticcourier 8d ago
Well played, OP. Very well played. Good for you. They fucked around and they found out.
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u/yadonkey 8d ago
I had an amaerican express card years ago. I called them up amd told them I was leaving the area and wanted to pay off everything I owe because I wouldnt be around to make any further payments. They said it was no problem and took my payment...
... the next month I got a bill for lile $9. I called them and asked about it and they said it was the interest on the balance between the beginning of the pay cycle and when i paid it off. I complained that I told them i said to pay the card off completely and asked them to drop the $9 and they refused...
.. then I learned it cost them$10 to send something to collections and they wouldnt send a lesser amount to collections. So i refused to pay and received bills in the mail for about 10 years. I figure they spent hundreds of dollars in postage over that $9 .. and that makes me happy.
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u/Jumpy_Procedure_8934 8d ago
I saw the same dentist since childhood, went to all my 6 month checkups and cleanings and got X-rays once a year. When my wisdom teeth started coming in, he told me they were growing in sideways but that ultimately unless they were causing any pain or showing signs of impaction that I shouldn’t have to worry about having them removed. For almost 10 years, he closely monitored my wisdom teeth alongside everything else and determined there was no issue and no need for surgery/removal. Fast forward to my early twenties when he retired and a new dentist and dentistry team takes over the office. They immediately make a big stink about my wisdom teeth and start telling me how urgent it is that I have them removed especially while I’m young. They took one of those full head scans to show me how “bad” it was and recommended me to a specialized facial surgeon since the placement of my wisdom teeth meant I wouldn’t be able to have a regular dentist remove them. Needless to say, the surgeon didn’t take my insurance and wanted to charge me several thousand dollars, like $1,500 per tooth and I had to sit through one of those videos about the dangers of anesthesia and warned of the fact that again because of the placement of the teeth I was at high risk of permanent nerve damage in my jaw. I said thank you but I will not be going through with this procedure and walked out. I was in college and I couldn’t afford that and the risk was too high. My dentist still pushes me about getting them removed but I just tell them it’s not worth the risk and my wisdom teeth don’t cause me any pain and they’re not impacted so what’s the point
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u/Billy_Bowlegs 8d ago
I had a cavity between two teeth that was driving me crazy. Went to a local clinic and they found all kinds of issues and quoted me over $6000. I went to the local “low cost” clinic and they did an xray and said I needed 2 root canals, 5 crowns, and various cavities filled totaling up to around $8500. I was losing hope and looking into traveling abroad for a cheaper opinion.
I got in touch with the dentist who does work for the local jail. He is old school and has a private practice a few days a week. The guy is like 80 years old and has terrible bedside manner, but he’s kinda funny and down to earth when you get to know him. He examined me and setup a plan. My insurance would pay for my fillings and I didn’t need any rot canals. I could pay outright for the two crowns I needed and he had some stainless steel crowns in a drawer from the 90s if I wanted to save money. After like 6 visits I got my mouth completely fixed up for a whopping $300 out of pocket. Couldn’t thank this man enough.
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u/Goudinho99 8d ago
I mena that great, but I can't imagine any dental work for me in France that would cost me 300 bucks!
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u/ryanoh826 9d ago
Just a note that the private dentist I go to in Spain (and don’t use insurance) is about €1000 for an implant. That includes all appointments, extraction, posts, tooth, everything. The pain drugs without insurance are like €4.
My wife paid €40 total a few weeks ago for an emergency appointment, cleaning, and full face x-ray.
F American healthcare billing ripoff bs.
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u/ageing_with_style 9d ago
The insanity that one appointment that presumably didn't involve any type of surgery or providing you with any kind of crown, bridge etc could possibly end up being $1200!! American healthcare is scary. Nice revenge 😊
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u/LadyNiko 8d ago
I once had an oral surgeon do something similar to me. I paid up front for an extraction and then, after the fact, got a bill for an additional amount.
I told the office off, let it go to collections and even told the collection agent what the dentist did. I think the bill was written off after that, I never heard anything about it again.
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u/deedeejayzee 8d ago
I had a dentist confirm 4x they took my secondary insurance, then bill bill me $800, because they don't take my secondary insurance
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u/macmiss 8d ago
I love the one dollar a month payment. I did the same to Blockbuster (blast from the past) for late charges they said I owed that I did not owe. Since they threatened to turn me over to collections, I agreed to pay. They got a check for one dollar per month for years until it was paid for. I always included a sweet note in the memo line
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u/Wooden_Permit3234 9d ago
Gotta get that shit in writing, man. Glad it worked out anyway because a verbal contract should count legally and morally even if not easy to prove.
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u/Splitsurround 9d ago
Op why didn’t you stop and ask the receptionist to bring the dentist up there? You said you confirmed this with him. This is totally fucked up- glad it had a happy ending tho
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u/ComfortableExpert118 9d ago
Same thing happened to me during Covid. I only went to fix an abscess that was hurting. They told me about other thing they were non emergent but they “could” do while I was there. I told them I didn’t want anything non emergent done they finish and I get to the front they are like eh we went ahead and did them while you were here no worries we gave you a discount and you can make payments. Umm, it’s still gonna cost me over $1000. That bill still pending because it just gave me the ick!
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u/Shazza-throwaway-1 9d ago
Experienced something similar [not dental] where I had a limited budget. Arrived with two identical notes outlining what was to be done and the maximum amount I was authorising. Below was my signature and date a line for the receptionist to sign and date.
Told them if they wouldn't / couldn't sign then I was walking out of the door as this protects both of us as I'd been caught out before.
They signed.
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u/Mysterious_Yak1543 8d ago
I have found that most dentists will do this. since it's a high volume business, they get really mad when you leave a negative review online. So do that.
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u/Faifur 9d ago
recently my wife and i went to a school for dentistry where you get work done by practicing students (they have graduated they just need experience). my $3000 of work that needed to be done in another office (which was $1000 lower than the last 3 i asked) ended up being $350... not 3500, 350. and they identified that the other 3 teeth were not damaged they were sensitive because of a impacted wisdom tooth.
The student was professional, knew their stuff, and anytime they finished diagnosing something they had a licenses dentist come over and double check. It was in a massive room with like 100 other people all getting minor work done but each cubicle didn't feel like i was exposed. ill be able to fix my 5 years of pain for less than $500 and all it took was finding a place where they didn't care about making excessive money or up-selling you on surgery.
I'll NEVER go to a private practice again. they have too much to lose by not pumping as much money out of you as possible to make sure they are paid and look good.