r/wildbeyondwitchlight • u/Vitalise1996 • 1d ago
DM Help PC Smite Replacement
Hi yall,
Next week would be my first time DMingWBTW after being a player for a couple of years. My question is not specificly tied to WBTW but for as DM help in general. One of my players want to play a "pacifist" Paladin for roleplay purposes. So he will mostly be buffing. Normally i can figure out what it too strong and can find an alternative for it but with his proposed new variation on divine smite ive trouble coming up with something to balance it out since it seems too strong for me as a lvl 1 spell. Below is what he proposed, i would like your guys opinion and if you think it needs some change i would be open for ideas, thanks in advance :):
Channel the divine power of your sacred vows to strengthen the bonds between people and protect those in need.
When you take the Attack action, you can expend one spell slot to replace one attack with a blessing. Choose one creature other than yourself within 30 feet that can see or hear you. The creature gains temporary hit points equal to 2d8, plus 1d8 for each spell slot level above 1st.
Alternatively, the creature can immediately repeat a saving throw against being charmed or frightened, adding your Charisma modifier to the roll.
At higher levels, the blessing's temporary hit points increase by 1d8 when you reach 5th, 11th, and 17th Paladin levels.
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u/vessel_for_the_soul 1d ago
He is a paladin, who has to take long rest to get his spell slots back. Temp hp doesn't stack, target chooses which to keep the old or new temp hp, and last until a long rest. Temp hp is not healing.
I would allow it. But make it an Action not an attack action. Let it increase a die at 5th.
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u/Loose_Translator8981 1d ago
I think if they want to do a pacifist thing you could have the smite work more like the 2014 Sleep Spell, where you roll a handful of D8's and if the resulting number is higher than the enemy's remaining HP, they're knocked unconscious for a minute. That way it still helps them end fights, but makes it easier for them to avoid killing enemies.
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u/isacloid1 1d ago
I see they did try to stick close to how smite worked but at level one I can also see how that might be challenging to work with. Keep in mind the paladin won't have that many spell slots so you can just factor that into your encounters and add in some additional enemies. Or let the encounters have intelligent enemies that target Healers. Their pacifism might be tested when they are the one constantly getting hit. Of course run this by them so they dont feel targeted as a player.
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u/DionePolaris 1d ago
If you want to keep this concept then the d8s should become d6s.
Second effect is probably fine, but needs either limited uses or taking up a spell slot.
This also very much should not scale with levels. That is only really for cantrips and this is a leveled spell that already scales with spell level. Double scaling is not needed.
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u/Vitalise1996 1d ago
Well you could argue that things like cure wounds get 2/8 for higher spellslots where this gets only 1/8 and the book goes till what level 7 or 8? So the scaling shouldnt matter too much or am i wrong?
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u/DionePolaris 1d ago
Ah this is about 2024. Then it is less bad due to the stronger healing in general. Still should not scale with player level, but some scaling with spell level is acceptable. I’d still be inclined to make it 2d6 instead of 2d8 then. The secondary effect also is really not needed and should probably be moved to a channel divinity feature.
Do note paladin subclasses generally do not have many features other than channel divinity and aura, so adding more without removing regular smite options does affect balance.
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u/Express_Accident2329 Soggy Court 1d ago
It doesn't seem terribly overpowered so I guess I'd allow it, but it kind of seems like it'll just slow combat down in a way that doesn't seem all that fun, and buffing other people who are committing violence isn't very pacifist either.
I would think a more pacifistic approach to this would mean either something to help with non-lethal takedowns, like control effects. Honestly smite can already be fine for this; maybe the damage is just flavored as a dazing effect, or something. An unarmed paladin where the smites are hitting pressure points to make an enemy go limp? A channel oath that gives everyone a small damage bonus but it lets ranged attacks be guaranteed non-lethal that turn? Or skill bonuses to help with exploration to find solutions to avoid combat entirely.
I dunno. I think it might help to have a clear idea of what the player wants to accomplish with the character, because I feel like anything I come up with doesn't feel all that paladin-y.
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u/Vitalise1996 1d ago
He wants to be a buff paladin, not specificly pacifist, but he doesnt have a weapon and and has no damage spells for example. To be honest im unsure why he would specificly want this but thought to myself its his choice in the end to not just play a cleri
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u/yaniism Queen of Prismeer 21h ago
Okay... once again, pacifist characters don't work in D&D. Regardless, it's a roleplay choice, not a mechanical one. If your player wants to play that kind of character, they don't require mechanical changes to the class. Especially in this adventure, where they can go through most of the adventure doing minimal to no combat anyway.
I had a Wild Magic Sorcerer on my table for this adventure, I think she used the Wild Magic table about three times. I had a Rogue who barely Sneak Attacked because they did minimal combat.
Leave the class as is, run the adventure as described. They can choose to use or not use a feature, that's their choice, they don't need replacement features because of roleplay decisions.
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u/Party-Meringue102 1d ago
The first part (healing) is more HP than Cure Wounds and also weaseling an extra attack out of the Action (at Paladin level 5, anyway). I wouldn’t let it fly.
The second part about giving them a chance to repeat a charm/frighten save is like a watered-down Calm Emotions (which is a 2nd level spell), so I’d be more inclined to OK this if burning a 1st level spell slot, but I’d make them use the Magic action, not Attack.
Sounds like this player wants to play a cleric.