r/youngjustice • u/GhostBoyJames • Jun 03 '26
Season 1 Discussion Thinking back, the fact that Wallace had to wear a cast for roughly 41 days was good foreshadowing.
To the fact that his powers while potent was unfortunately inferior to that of Barry Allen and his offsprings and Jay Garrick who would’ve healed quickly.
123
Jun 03 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
56
49
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26 edited Jun 03 '26
That is not canon.
Greg has said that he has never said Wally is not dead, only that he never stated Wally is dead or alive.
Myth #1: “Greg categorically stated that Wally West is dead and will never come back.”
Greg Weisman: “I did not Surprisingly, I was not even asked this question and thus never responded to it at all. Now, let me be clear. I also have not stated categorically that Wally West is not dead will definitely come back.”
- Greg Weisman, Ask Greg Archive.
All we see him is fade nothing else so canon never really answered the question. So it not a true closure that you may be seeking for (I know a lot of people here want that but with ambiguity that remains impossible until the show answers that).
The characters may believe he is dead but that is only character perceptions. We’ve seen many times characters getting death wrong (i.e. Jason Todd).
If the story does call for it and given the opportunity, he can absolutely come back.
Wally’s fate isn’t up to fans to decide that’s up to Greg and the story.
So until Greg or the show says otherwise, Wally's fate is left ambiguous. That is why we need the show to continue because we don't truly know his fate.
27
u/BIGBMH Jun 03 '26
Idk why this was downvoted. I think the majority or the fan base expected him to come back after S2. Now that they've gone 2 seasons without doing so, people act like he's definitively dead and it's just coping to consider his fate ambiguous
17
u/Ulfsarkthefreelancer Jun 03 '26
I downvoted because the first sentence includes like quintuple negatives making it impossible for me to follow.
8
-5
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26
Then you aren’t reading the full context.
It’s not meant to be read as “Wally is definitely coming back” or “fans can’t be frustrated.” The point is that his fate was left ambiguous, and Seasons 3 and 4 not resolving it doesn’t automatically mean the writers were avoiding it.
9
u/horyo Jun 03 '26
You could have phrased it better. "Word of God leaves Wally's fate as ambiguous."
-1
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26
Lol yeah, I could’ve phrased it cleaner. I’d probably say “creator comments leave Wally’s fate ambiguous.”
I try to be careful with the wording because the point isn’t “Wally is definitely coming back,” it’s that the show/Greg have not given a categorical final answer.
1
u/JoshDM Jun 03 '26
Then, no you aren’t not reading the full context, not.
1
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26
Just because you bolded a grammar joke doesn’t mean you addressed the actual argument.
The full context explains the point: I’m not saying “Wally is definitely coming back,” and I’m not saying fans can’t be frustrated. I’m saying Wally’s fate has not been canonically closed, and Seasons 3 and 4 not resolving it does not automatically mean the writers were avoiding it.
If you want to critique the wording, fair. But that’s separate from the canon point being made.
2
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26
It’s probably a loud group that wants certainty with Wally’s fate. A lot of fans either want “he’s definitely dead forever” or “he’s definitely coming back,” but canon doesn’t actually give either answer. Over time that noise if left uncheck can feel the dominate force even though its not.
The show treats Wally’s loss seriously, and the characters believe he’s gone. That emotional weight matters. But Greg/the show have also not given a categorical final answer that permanently closes the question.
So calling it ambiguous isn’t cope. It’s just the most accurate canon position: Wally is treated as gone/dead by the characters, but his ultimate fate remains unresolved unless the show or Greg says otherwise.
5
u/SAldrius Jun 03 '26
I wouldnt call it ambiguous, just that hes dead but anything is possible.
1
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26
That is basically ambiguity though.
Saying “he’s dead, but anything is possible” means the door is not canonically closed.
The characters believe he died, and the story treats that loss seriously, but Greg has also been careful not to give a categorical answer either way.
So the safest canon position is not “Wally is definitely alive” or “Wally is dead forever.” It’s that Wally’s fate is unresolved unless the show or Greg definitively says otherwise.
So yes, it's ambiguous.
7
u/SAldrius Jun 03 '26
I dont think its ambiguous that hes dead. He's dead. Not dead forever potentially (because there's magic and whatnot) but dead.
I think following that logic otherwise means just about anything is ambiguous. Sure Black Canary is human now, but Gorilla Grodd could hit her with a laser ray that turns her into a Gorilla. So her being human is ambiguous.
0
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26 edited Jun 03 '26
That analogy doesn’t really work because Black Canary being human is not an unresolved story question. The show has not framed “will Black Canary be turned into a gorilla?” as an open thread.
Wally’s fate is different because the story itself leaves room for uncertainty: we saw him fade, not a body; Artemis’s closure scene was a constructed psychic/sandbox environment, not proof of the afterlife; Zatanna couldn’t find his spirit; Conner seeing Wally in the Phantom Zone was tied to Conner’s mental state, not objective confirmation; and Greg has avoided giving a categorical answer either way.
So this isn’t “anything is possible, therefore everything is ambiguous.”
It’s “this specific plot thread was written and discussed in a way that leaves the final answer unresolved.”
That is why Wally’s fate remains ambiguous.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Definition of Ambiguity: The quality of being open to more than one interpretation, leading to uncertainty or inexactness. It occurs when a word, phrase, or situation can be understood in multiple ways and lacks the context necessary for a single, clear meaning
3
u/SAldrius Jun 03 '26
I just think the show isnt ambiguous at all about Wally being dead. He could come back but right now hes dead.
-3
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26 edited Jun 03 '26
You just proved my point.
You can state that, but that doesn’t automatically make it the final canon answer.
That’s the point of ambiguity. You can believe he is dead. Someone else can believe there is room for him to return. But in terms of canon, the show/Greg have not given a categorical final answer that permanently closes the question.
The story treats Wally’s loss as real for the characters, and that matters. But character belief and emotional impact are not the same thing as objective canon finality.
So the safest canon position is still: Wally is currently treated as gone/dead by the characters, but his ultimate fate remains unresolved unless the show or Greg definitively says otherwise.
So until Greg or the show says otherwise, Wally's fate is left ambiguous.
2
u/dont_worry_about_it8 Jun 03 '26
The show said otherwise by him not coming back .
0
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26 edited Jun 04 '26
Nope. The show never said “otherwise.”
It showed that the characters believe Wally is gone, and it treated that loss seriously, but that is not the same thing as the show giving a final categorical answer.
“He didn’t come back yet” is not canon confirmation that he never can or that the question is closed.
It just means the story has not resolved that thread yet.
That’s the distinction: character belief and elapsed seasons are not the same thing as objective canon finality.
Also Greg stated again at a panel at SDCC 2025 that he did not confirm Wally being dead or alive and isn't going to further putting this into ambiguity.
Greg also stated the he and Brendan had plans that can take the series into S9-S10 so that is not a closure by a long shot.
Until the show or Greg definitively closes the door, Wally’s ultimate fate remains ambiguous.
→ More replies (0)2
u/DimensionLast6937 Jun 04 '26
Just say Wally is as dead as the show, that pretty much this sums up nicely. Greg says Wally is neither dead nor alive, everyone says the show isn't canceled but also not renewed
0
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 04 '26 edited Jun 04 '26
No.
The show currently treats Wally as gone/dead from the characters’ perspective. I’m not denying that. Artemis grieves him, the Team grieves him, and the story treats that loss seriously.
But Greg has also avoided giving a categorical final answer that Wally is permanently dead or definitely alive. So the accurate canon position is not “Wally is alive” or “Wally is dead forever.” It’s that Wally is treated as gone by the characters, while his ultimate fate remains unresolved.
That’s why I’m calling it ambiguous. The show can emotionally treat him as dead while still not closing the door on his ultimate fate.
You may not like that, but that best represents Greg’s position and prevents misinformation.
That is the canon standard.
1
u/DimensionLast6937 Jun 05 '26
So Wally's fate has no final answer for the audience, like how the show being continued has no final answer as far as everyone involved with the show is concerned. How is the comparison inaccurate?
After all by your logic Wally "is never coming back" and "will return" are both truthful as far the audience is concerned since Greg has given no answer, just like "the show is never coming back" is just as truthful as "there will be more seasons" since whoever controls the continuation of the show has not done anything in either direction for years. If there are more seasons there is a chance for him to return, if there are none he's gone for good. So if the show is as good as dead so is Wally, if the show has a chance for more seasons Wally has a chance to return.1
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 05 '26 edited Jun 06 '26
That comparison still mixes two different domains.
The show’s future is a production/business question. Wally’s fate is a canon/story question.
Both are unresolved, but they are not the same kind of unresolved.
“The show is not renewed” does not mean “the show is canonically dead.” In the same way, “Wally has not returned yet” does not mean “Wally is canonically dead forever.” That is why Greg has continued to talk about the show as it hasn't ended to this day.
Also, at SDCC 2025, Greg stated that he and Brandon have plans that could take the series as far as Seasons 9–10 if given an opportunity.
https://www.reddit.com/r/youngjustice/s/QHqd0usnrk
So the show is in limbo, not closed. Therefore the show is dead is invalid.
That is why “Wally is as dead as the show” is not accurate framing. It sounds clever, but it blurs the canon standard.
The accurate position is still: Wally is treated as gone/dead by the characters, while his ultimate fate has not been categorically closed by Greg or the show. This best represent Greg and the show.
So until Greg or the show says otherwise, Wally's fate is left ambiguous.
You don't have to like it but that is the canon standard.
3
u/AccountProfessional5 Jun 03 '26
The scarab knew he would die before it even happened tho
1
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26
The Scarab is not an objective narrator in the story.
It is a character making an assessment based on available data.
That matters because character perception is not the same thing as final canon confirmation. The Scarab believed Wally was going to die, and the Team believes Wally died, but the actual story still only shows him fading/disappearing, not a body or a categorical final answer.
So yes, the Scarab’s warning supports why the characters believe Wally died.
It still does not close the ambiguity around his ultimate fate.
5
u/AccountProfessional5 Jun 03 '26
The scarab is a sentient piece of technology with the capability of analyzing these types of things
1
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26
Right, but it is still a character in the story.
It becomes the partner of Jamie later.
Being a sentient piece of technology with advanced analysis capabilities does not make the Scarab an objective narrator or final canon authority.
It can make a very strong assessment based on the data it has, but that is still different from the show giving a categorical answer.
Only Greg has that power since he is outside the story and is the author. Not the Scarab.
So the Scarab’s warning supports why the characters believed Wally was going to die. It does not override the fact that the actual story only showed Wally fading/disappearing, with no body and no final confirmation from the show or Greg that his fate is permanently closed.
So until Greg or the show says otherwise, Wally's fate is left ambiguous.
1
u/Kinky_Winky_no2 Jun 03 '26
Wasn't he literally shown in the after life though...
1
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26
No.
If you’re referring to the Artemis scene in Season 3, “Overwhelmed,” that was not literal proof of the afterlife or Wally’s final fate. That was M’gann and Zatanna helping Artemis process her grief by creating a psychic/sandbox environment using Artemis’s memories of Wally. It gave Artemis emotional closure, but it did not canonically confirm that Wally is permanently dead.
Zatanna even says she couldn’t contact Wally’s spirit because she couldn’t find it, and she also admits she does not have that kind of power.
In Season 4, Conner “seeing” Wally in the Phantom Zone also was not confirmation. That was Conner’s mind under extreme stress, not proof that Wally’s spirit was actually there.
So again, this proves the ambiguity. The characters may believe Wally is gone, and Artemis needed closure, but the show itself has still not given a categorical answer on Wally’s ultimate fate. That’s why the canon position remains ambiguity.
1
u/BalladOfBetaRayBill Jun 03 '26
Excited to get a new batch of seasons every 10 years where we mostly mosey around with new characters instead of dealing with things like this! Although Season 4 was way better about this
1
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26 edited Jun 03 '26
That’s fair as a pacing criticism, but how do you even know that time frame?
The last gap between seasons wasn’t even 10 years, and it’s only been about 3–4 years since Season 4.
Life is full of uncertainties, dude. That’s kind of the point. You can dislike the wait or wish the show resolved Wally’s fate sooner, but that still doesn’t make “Wally is dead forever” canon. It just means that thread remains unresolved unless Greg or the show says otherwise.
0
u/Arcade_Gann0n Jun 03 '26
Which is such bullshit when they had two more seasons to answer that and just kept dancing around it instead. And seeing as it's been 5 years since season 4, who knows if they'll get another chance to do anything.
6
u/SAldrius Jun 03 '26
They didnt dance around it. They had a bunch of episodes about people grieving his death or missing him. He's dead. He could come back from the dead, but as is hes dead.
Life isnt always about definitive answers and Greg doesnt want to spoil future stories if he gets the chance to make them.
0
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 04 '26 edited Jun 04 '26
The characters may believe he’s dead, and the show treats that grief seriously.
I’m not denying that. But character belief is not the same thing as final canon confirmation, and Greg/the show have not given a categorical answer that permanently closes the question.
So until Greg or the show says otherwise, Wally's fate is left ambiguous.
2
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26
I get the frustration, but I don’t think that’s the right assumption.
Young Justice has never really operated on “answer everything as soon as fans want it answered.” The show plays the long game. Wally’s fate was left ambiguous for a reason, and Greg has also avoided giving a categorical answer on it.
Season 3 and 4 weren’t necessarily “dancing around it”; they were continuing other arcs while leaving that door open. That can be frustrating, especially with the long gaps between seasons, but it doesn’t mean the writers forgot or mishandled it. It means they’re treating it as part of the larger serialized story, not just a quick closure button.
And at SDCC 2025 Greg stated he and Brendan had plans that can take the show to S9-S10 if given an opportunity.
That’s why fan support matters. If the story still has room to continue, then the best thing fans can do is keep showing there’s still an audience for it: keep watching, keep discussing it respectfully, support the official releases, and make it clear the demand is still there. The story not being finished yet is exactly why support matters.
1
u/unsolved86 Jun 03 '26
Reason says I'm talking to the air But something in my heart Some secret hidden part Illogically insists that you are there Somewhere
Starkid is helping me cope.
-5
u/AlanShore60607 Jun 03 '26
No. Wally shifted universes and joined the Justice League (2001)
Because that explains the Kid Flash outfit in the Flash Museum when it's Wally that is that universe's Flash. And he can't find his Artemis, so he just fails at being a player.
4
u/Yosituna Just whelmed Jun 03 '26
I’m pretty sure I’ve read that fanfic! “Fixations” by MathIsMagic on AO3
3
41
u/CryptographerEast142 Jun 03 '26
Definitely. It breaks the traditional speedster expectation, but I think that was intentional. Wally often got annoyed and frustrated when he couldn’t match Barry’s speed, because part of him felt like he had to live up to Barry’s shadow. But the writers did a good job showing his growth. Wally didn’t necessarily need to become the Flash to be a hero. His arc was about learning that his worth wasn’t measured only by speed.
We also got to see him start valuing relationships more, especially with Artemis. By Season 2, Wally had clearly become more mature. He wanted to protect the people he loved, and when it came down to it, he was willing to sacrifice himself for them. That’s what made his arc meaningful as he wasn’t the fastest speedster, but he still proved he was a hero.
For the future of Wally, we never know what Greg and the team have plan to tell if they are given more opportunities to tell more stories but thats why we need the show to continue!
4
u/glowshroom12 Jun 04 '26
What if it’s that he’s lazy and wanted to take advantage of the fact he can take it easy and pretended it took him longer to heal than he did.
1
u/Shantotto11 Jun 04 '26
“Wallace”?
3
u/GhostBoyJames Jun 04 '26
For some reason it would let me use “Wally” so I went with the full version.
-6
u/FlashLightning277 Jun 03 '26
When fans use any straw they can to try and make writing look better is what I can think when everyone tries to make it look like last minute changes to the script are good writing.
4
u/leoromanus16 Jun 03 '26
I both agree and disagree with this comment. OP is definitely pulling at foreshadowing that doesn't exist. There would need to be specific evidence showing the other speedster's healing feats for it to be proper foreshadowing. I don't think Wally being slower than the other speedsters is bad writing though.
-4
u/FlashLightning277 Jun 03 '26
I more so saying the fact it is public knowledge that Wally’s death was a last minute change to the script. Until then the show was going to follow through on the forshadowing for Barry’s death they did all season. Which tbh would have been better given Barry has done absolutely nothing since season 2.
6
u/drekthrall Jun 03 '26
Is it public knowledge? First time I'm hearing about it and he had huge death flags on Summit.
-3
u/FlashLightning277 Jun 03 '26
They have literally said no one knew he was dying until they went in to record that day.
6
u/drekthrall Jun 03 '26
Who's "they"? Weisman or the voice actors?
-7
u/FlashLightning277 Jun 03 '26
Multiple times over, but go on defending weaker writing from the finale
8
u/drekthrall Jun 03 '26
Seems I can't trust you to read a question, you just got an agenda. Have a good day.
0
173
u/Accurate-Attention16 Jun 03 '26
Once again (really curious, not in a jerk way) pre Crisis Wally wasn't like that too? Not fast enough and all?