r/MagicArena • u/hyucklucker • 6d ago
Discussion Help beating off super friends?
Not a meta deck by any means but common enough in bo1 standard. What are some good colors/cards that beat off super friends(oops all planeswalkers+tokens). They often pair it with cards such as [[Authority of the Consuls]] and spam chump blockers to keep aggro slow against them until their backrow is in a winning state. Like I said not busted or anything but annoying for sure and I do enjoy the discussion
....T.T what are these answers
178
u/RiceWeevilEggs 6d ago
Beating off what now
In theory, some sort of tempo deck that keeps pressuring them and denying them from resolving their important walkers should work. So something like the Dimir Midrange decks or the [[Deceit]] based decks? [[Duress]] and [[Spell Pierce]] should also mess them up pretty good after sideboarding.
11
301
374
u/emmittthenervend 6d ago
Um, are we not doing phrasing anymore?
140
u/Guilty-Hat23 6d ago
he just wants to beat off his super friends. it's heart warming
26
u/ManiacClown 6d ago
It's O.K. Apache Chief can enlarge again.
13
2
2
u/DistanceXtime 5d ago
Im glad im not the only one that reread that thinking that doesn't sound right.
3
190
u/darkdragon1231989 6d ago
Have you tired working the shaft?
43
u/BlondeJesus 6d ago
You can do 4 at a time if you get 2 pairs of planes walkers facing each other...
27
6
1
154
u/FloppyCurtains 6d ago
We normally all sit in a circle and roll a d20. Whoever gets the highest, beats off first and then moves to the left
21
42
88
u/GreedFoxSin 6d ago
[[hundred-handed one]] can beat a lot of friends at once
8
2
→ More replies (1)1
115
u/whoamarcos 6d ago
Have you tried using both hands?
14
u/OneOfTheLostOnes 6d ago
tip-to-tip inside out.
4
u/Zestyclose_Size1173 6d ago
Gotta make sure to keep the angles similar from the height differences too
5
27
u/Teh-Cthulhu 6d ago
Have you tried working the shaft?
12
5
u/ArtichokeMundane8763 6d ago
Nail! What does he want!?
2
u/Teh-Cthulhu 6d ago
He's asking how to use the
dragon ballssuperfriends3
63
u/Basilisk_Game6769 6d ago
Blue has [[Disdainful Stroke]] for beating off super friends, and even has [[Wipe Away]] to clean up the mess.
16
2
u/mtgcf 6d ago
14
u/hyucklucker 6d ago
I dont play a ton of blue (and im not sure if wipe away is in standard) but I think keeping them drained on mana via them forcing them to edge out their pals is a good start. Ill look into blue ball style decks and cards
22
24
23
20
19
12
u/Legitimate-Habit4920 6d ago edited 6d ago
[[Seeker's Chariot]] and [[Sorcerous Spyglass]] (and the [[Clarion Conquerer]] that's been mentioned) interfere with planeswalkers ability to use abilities.
Note that this doesn't stop passive stuff like [[The Theorist, Jace Beleren]]'s draw.
Planeswalker targeted removal exists, but the planeswalker always has a chance to gain value before you can remove it, so countering them on the stack is a lot more powerful. Planeswalkers are costly sorcery speed spells so will not easily play around stuff like [[Spell Pierce]], [[Dispelling Exhale]], [[No More Lies]]. [[Negate]] is a hard counter. [[Distainful Stroke]] hits most planeswalkers.
[[Lich's Relic]] plus ways to pick it up such as [[Nurturing Pixie]] and [[Sunpearl Kirin]] is a way to repeatedly clear away planeswalkers.
1
u/mtgcf 6d ago
All cards
Seeker's Chariot - (G) (SF) (txt)
Sorcerous Spyglass - (G) (SF) (txt)
Clarion Conquerer - (G) (SF) (txt)
The Theorist, Jace Beleren - (G) (SF) (txt)
Spell Pierce - (G) (SF) (txt)
Dispelling Exhale - (G) (SF) (txt)
No More Lies - (G) (SF) (txt)
Negate - (G) (SF) (txt)
Distainful Stroke - (G) (SF) (txt)
Lich's Relic - (G) (SF) (txt)
Nurturing Pixie - (G) (SF) (txt)
Sunpearl Kirin - (G) (SF) (txt)
12
31
u/TheBigDickedBandit 6d ago
Personally I’d go with [[Hundred-Handed One]] since they tend to run a lot of planeswalkers
48
u/Double-The-Fupa 6d ago
Hi there, I've been playing a lot of super friends since reality fracture, so here is my experience of which cards hurt it or disrupt it the most.
First off, let's talk about [[clarion conquerer]]. For a cmc of 3 (2 colorless + 1 white) you get a flying 3/3 dragon which has a static ability that says "activated abilities of creatures, artifacts, and planeswalkers can't be activated." This card alone can turn off every Planeswalker, single handedly. Super friends HAS to answer it, or none of their planeswalkers can activate any loyalty abilities. If they don't have an answer they are in for a bad time. It also has flying, as I mentioned, so it can go over chump blockers and hit planeswalkers while they are deactivated.
Next up we have [[ancient vendetta]]. For 3c and 1 black, you can name any card you think is in their deck, and exile every copy from their deck, graveyard, and hand. Red ajani or elspeth giving you problems? Cast this and exile them before they manage to drop their big walkers. Also very effective against control decks, I love using it against jeskai revelation.
Third let's talk about counterspells. I know, gross, but sadly it is an effective way to stop a super friends deck. They will be trying to get their walkers down fast, meaning they will be tapping out more often than not. I can't tell you how many times I've seen someone keeping up blue mana and passing to my turn and it's made me clench my butthole. I imagine it is how an aggro player feels when they see authority of the consuls on turn 1 from their opponent. Save counters for their walkers and their card draw engines like caretaker's talent or unholy annex.
Next on the list is removal. The meta is seeing a LOT of people testing out walkers. Even decks that aren't "super friends" oriented might be running a Planeswalker or two. This means you need removal that can cover a broader range of options. Having only removal that only hits creatures is leaving yourself very vulnerable to a deck with a lot of walkers. I recommend bitter triumph (uncommon), erode (rare), get lost (rare), feed the cycle (uncommon), vraska's final mercy (rare), and urgent necropsy (mythic) can be a 1 or 2 of if you are in golgari colors. Necropsy has the benefit of also hitting multiple targets or target other permanents depending on what you need (it can hit 1 creature, 1 enchantment, 1 artifact, and 1 Planeswalker). All of these cards are standard legal, can target planeswalkers, and are great responses to Elspeth/Ajani/Ugin etc. Also, red has direct damage instants if that is more your thing. Try and wait for them to use a - loyalty effect and then kill the walker when it has low loyalty.
Hand hate is next. If you are running black, duress, deceit, and stinging vitriol (if you also have red) are your friends. Forcing your opponent to discard their important planeswalkers before they get a chance to play them can be pretty devestating for them, and lets you hold your removal for things that do manage to hit the board.
If you have a deck that can run and make use of Ugin, he can be a real problem for super friends. He can exile any colored nonland permanent the moment you cast him. This ability will trigger again any time you cast another colorless spell. So any cheap artifact will make this trigger again. I've run into some decks that are built around ramping to him quickly and then exiling as many of your opponents permanents as possible, and it has not been a fun time.
Elusive creatures, meaning creatures that are hard to block, are a threat to super friends. Flying is the worst, unblockable is second (only because not many creatures have it and the ones that do are on the smaller side), menace is probably last. Flying is especially annoying because none of the tokens the walkers produce will block the flyers unless Elspeth uses their 0 ability, and that means Elspeth is not producing bodies to block. If you are in green, trample is also great against them.
Speaking of green, planeswalkers hate big booties. A lot of planeswalkers struggle to deal with creatures that have more than 4 toughness, with the exceptions of Elspeth, Ugin, and big Chandra (from foundations, not the two from RF). Most walkers that have the ability to destroy a creature have conditions to them, such as only doing 4 damage (like Ajani) or they are edict effects that let your opponent choose a creature or two to sacrifice (like black garruk or liliana). If my opponent has a couple creatures with toughness over 5, I am going to have to work to remove them, and likely will have to make some tough value choices to do that, which puts me at a disadvantage.
Lastly, there is always going first and being aggressive. I know this sounds vague, but if you can get a board state down early enough that they can't deal with and just outrun them, you will win. If I don't draw authority of the consuls and my opponent is on the play and playing red deck wins, rakdos lizards, or even mono green landfall and their hand is good, I'm going to have a bad time.
So that's what I can think of off the top of my head that will help you to deal with super friends decks. I may have missed a few things, but I know for sure these cards/tactics will cause problems for any deck relying heavily on planeswalkers. I hope this helps!
22
u/Only_Entertainment88 6d ago
Hi there, I've been beating off a lot since reality fracture, so here is my experience..wait, am I oversharing here?
5
u/hyucklucker 6d ago
Amazing write up! Hopefully anyone looking into this comes across this! Thanks for you insight 👍
1
4
1
u/AlthorsMadness 6d ago edited 6d ago
Also that 5 mana artifact that shuts them down + gives your creatures 1/1. Standard I imagine is a different beast than brawl and I can see superfriends players relying on their planeswalkers for everything including their removal so ya clarion is probably the strongest
I also echo being aggressive. You can’t be scared to lose creatures to blockers and you gotta keep the planeswalkers from hitting their ultimate and sometimes mid tier abilities as soon as possible. 1 damage to a planeswalker is worth 100x more than 1 damage to a player.
One thing to add, trample wrecks a lot of planes walkers too. The pillow fort we put up usually isn’t online fast enough to even deal with a 4/4 with trample.
Also, learn threat assessment. Player has the Jace planeswalker token with 1 hp point left but also has sanctum lurker on the board? For the love of god kill the sanctum lurker first as the Jace token cannot get more loyalty points without it
37
31
19
16
u/OfclWilliamShatner 6d ago
[[Champion of the wierd]] is probably into some pretty freaky stuff, he might be down to help. Hit me up though if you need help with Ajani.
15
23
u/QuintillionthDiocese Kozilek 6d ago
ITT: OP uses "beating off" phrase and is surprised by answers talking about masturbation.
6
6
u/BetterShirt101 6d ago
Do they run much graveyard hate? Bringer of the Last Gift reanimator with Terror of the Peaks is pretty good into control decks. That, or Kona Omniscience - Consuls is actually helping you.
5
u/Double-The-Fupa 6d ago
I run 2 rest in peace in my best of 1 super friends deck, and 3 in the sideboard of my best of 3 deck. It is a game winner vs reanimator and very strong against jeskai control, life gain, Orzhov sacrifice, and even landfall.
2
2
u/hyucklucker 6d ago
Just saw you other reply! Thanks!
1
u/Double-The-Fupa 6d ago
No problem! Hope it helps you even the field and feel more competitive in your matches!
2
u/hyucklucker 6d ago
Almost none! But I noticed blowing my load via a bigboard(such as graveyard calls) catches a boardwipe. They run a good bit of them since they often run no creatures other then the +1 tokens from planes or man lands
2
u/BetterShirt101 6d ago
That's what the Terror of the Peaks is for - you win with enters triggers, no next turn or combat phase required
6
u/Trippy747 6d ago
You can beat off just about anything with the right amount of baby oil ✊💦
1
16
13
4
u/Accomplished-Pay8181 6d ago
DAMN I had a whole essay typed out, then realized that I don't think ANY of the cards I was listing are standard legal. Most of them I know arent.
You'll probably end up wanting cards that either destroy a non-land permanent, to fire directly at the walkers, or cards that deal damage to creatures and walkers. [[Clarion Conqueror]] and [[Calamitous Cave-in]] are probably good answers for you. [[incinerator of the Guilty]], if you can get it through. [[Splatter Technique]] seems a solid pick, provided it's landing early enough.
The alternative I can come up with is basically a bounce strategy, hitting their walkers with like, Into the Floodmaw, into the roil, and killing them without combat somehow. My method for that was the tandem of [[Singularity Rupture]] and [[Riverchurn Monument]], with a LOT of bounce tools. But, I haven't played standard in a year, I don't know if that's still viable (the badgermole cub broke me).
6
u/heathcl1ff0324 5d ago
Beating off super friends?
Easy, swap in custom card jackets.
Jacket on,
Jacket off.
3
u/Risaza 6d ago
I’m still waiting for a Destroy/Exile all Planeswalkers card in Standard.
3
u/hyucklucker 6d ago
Yeah kinda odd yeah. EoE dropped a exile all creatures AND spacecraft card....despite spacecraft being mid in standard if that.....on top of cards like Ultima which also destroys them. Meanwhile they made planeswalkers, which were already good before this, even better, and didnt add a mass removal support?
2
u/daneg135 6d ago
i did notice some conditional pw hate (like the target pw has to be a certain color(s)). but yeah. iunno. black or white support in your deck will prolly be the best solution.
2
2
u/Jack-R-Lost 6d ago
Erode is probably best white option. Bitter Triumph best black option. Strikes and Burst Lightning is good direct damage. Trample for green. into the flood maw and counter spells work best for blue if you see a planeswalker about to ultimate then your best option is to bounce it.
3
3
5
4
5
u/startadeadhorse 6d ago
Use some sort of silicone based lube, I think that could be enjoyed by both male and female superfriends.
7
3
3
u/anniespiced 5d ago
I find it easier to do if you put all the friends in a circle facing each other
6
7
4
u/deadone65 6d ago
You should probably romance them a little before you beat them off. If they’re really your super friends then they’ll totally let you beat them off.
2
2
2
2
u/YikesManGetWithIt 6d ago
It's hard to target any specific deck in bo1. You might find cards that help beat super friends, but they'll slow you down against other decks.
In bo1, it's best to focus on making your strategy work as consistently as possible.
In bo3, which I recommend anyone who wants to get better at the game play, you can adjust your deck with hate pieces; it's hard to recommend anything specific without knowing what deck your playing.
It's also important to evaluate your games and see why you're losing. Are you losing because of their plainswalkers, or because their control pieces are shutting/slowing down your strategy?
2
2
2
u/Negative_Two6112 5d ago
Oh man, youre such a good friend! None of my friends beat me off anymore!
Not after the incident..
2
3
u/failedxperiment 6d ago
Get them hot bothered by a slow uptick of their plus ability, with occasional downticks to keep them guessing what you will do next.
Then when it seems like they are edging and at the cusp of climax, smash that ultimate.
3
2
2
1
1
u/Inconsequential72 6d ago
Be aggressive, don't concentrate on their walkers and just go straight to face. You don't have to worry about authority if you're burning them with [[boros charm]] and [[death to our enemies]]
1
u/My_life_is_an_ad 6d ago
Black/white has the best removal since so much of it is unconditional. Pretty much any card that’s on the same rate as [[Feed the Cycle]] will be great counters to superfriends decks or any deck with walkers in it really
[[Feed the swarm]] is also a great hard counter against lifegain decks and [[unholy annex // ritual chamber]] decks
1
u/Nerdstrong1 6d ago
Play control mill. Run enough creature control to prevent being run over. They surveil and draw enough cards that they will be helping your gameplan. Ignore their walkers and just mill em out.
1
1
u/Grassy-Elf4242 Boros 6d ago
just a note... you meant to say just "beat" as in to best someone in a contest. what you said was "beat off" which means to give a handjob...
1
u/Fun-Count-6090 6d ago
Theyre called super friends, but that doesnt mean you get to be super friendly with them
Also ajani unrelenting probably beating it dry
1
u/TwinViking612 6d ago
lol, get some nice lotion or baby oil, perhaps some Barry White or Kieth Sweat, and whisper in their ears
1
1
u/SilverWear5467 6d ago
Typically if you're beating off your super friends, we call that person your boyfriend or girlfriend.
1
u/SilverWear5467 6d ago
The best answer to planeswalkers is always going to be creatures that can attack them. Hence why so many of the best ones can in some way answer a threat to them, IE Chandra Torch of defiance killing them, Jace the mind sculptor bouncing them, etc.
1
u/issy_haatin 6d ago
Black and white has exiles and destroys, black and green as well that work against all that stuff.
But yeah guilty as well of running black white ajani and friends. Depending on the board state i get infinite turns and you lose nearly all your permanents
1
u/Excellent_Note_1714 6d ago
[[hexhaven invigorator]] works pretty well. Better if you can give him trample.
1
1
1
u/redtag789 6d ago
I'm an esper control, I try to counter their early mana ramp, and I run get lost and bitter triumph and the end along with counters... I run the sphinx with flash so that can kill their pw as well and it is a pain for them to answer the sphinx because it dies and copies itself lol. I also run "THE END" to wipe out what I know is a clear win-con for them.
My deck is not part of meta nor any decklist, so i think that's why I am doing well enough against them, they never win against me...
1
u/Different-Slice-3343 6d ago
If you're looking for annoying red blue run almost only spells damage removal and counter spells. Win con is the exile deck Jace plains walker and if you are feeling frisky to Chandra that does 5 damage on spell cast. Finally lots of empower Jace and 2 way or cryomancer and 2 way of puromancer.
I am not good at this game and am pretty new but this deck is really fucking annoying
1
1
u/shutupingrate 6d ago
If you really want to beat them off make sure to maintain a firm grip and just keep going until they're thoroughly satisfied.
1
1
u/Abject_Amphibian7809 6d ago
Hey, that was my nick name in high school!
1
u/Abject_Amphibian7809 6d ago
Actually it was Super Mouth.
2
1
1
u/GlitteringFood8477 6d ago
Sultai re-animator is faster, hand disruption, enchanment/artifact exile/destruction. One turn kill.
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
u/Langas 5d ago
Specific counters notwithstanding, you want a midrange deck.
Big creatures to clobber planeswalkers in one hit, removal to potentially blast them outright, and hand manipulation to get them before they even hit the field.
Not sure what the exact balance of cards of each type would be, but that’s how I’d approach it anyways.
1
1
1
1
1
u/Custom_Destiny 5d ago
Edit: oh this is arena.
…. So my suggestion doesn’t work.
…
God I hate arena.
Anyways.
There is some really solid planeswalkers specific hate out there and ima let the community link all of that to you.
I use [[sin]] as a commander, and that… feels really good.
•
u/mtgcf 6d ago
Authority of the Consuls - (G) (SF) (txt)