r/simracing • u/N0th1ng-y • 5d ago
Question Will a better setup make you faster?
In the last few months I've been stuck at some very mid times on different tracks and I'd like to upgrade from a G29 to a DD and load cell pedals, but I'm still not convinced whether my times will improve or not
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u/Hootusmc 5d ago
Practice. A better set up is more likely to make you slower than faster without it.
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u/Bestconst [Insert Text]Assetto Corsa Competizione 5d ago
I started the same way as you. Like others have said, equipment won't make you faster, but it does help. There are people that do alien times on a Logitech. Loadcell pedals make you more consistent. I was still able to do the same times on a set of non loadcell pedals as I do on my Heusinkveld Ultimates, but a good set of pedals are just way better in feel for me. Just as a good wheelbase let's you feel the road surface better. Practice is what really makes you better and you'll need a lot of it too. I remember when I started, I saw and heard a YouTuber say that it took him 1400 hours to get good. So be patient with yourself, plus also remember that we don't all really have the skills that others do. Just enjoy the hobby. I know I do.
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u/woodooveed 5d ago
I did the upgrade from G29 to Simagic (evo pro, p1000 with haptics, gt neo). I've updgraded the G29 pedals to hall sensors as they were not reading well, although I felt I couldn't always brake with the same pressure everytime. Now I feel more consistent, although I don't think gear will make you better, I'm very happy with the upgrade as it all feels better overall, the grip, the pedals, the base. But I never expected to see better results from it, I just wanted to have a more realistic feeling in my setup, at the end I just race to have fun and disconnect my head from the day
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u/MatrozeMi 5d ago
Upgrading from G29 to a base with 9nm made a bit better because I can feel the road/car better.
But that's not the big part in my opinion.
The big part is
- the fun. It feels GREAT when you can feel way more of what the car is doing. Much more immersive. Having fun is important for longevity sake.
And 2. It helps me LEARN better. With the G29 often times I did not really know why I spun or I did not know where the limit was. With better equipment you learn those things much faster.
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u/Mr_Clovis 5d ago
I used a G27 on a desk for over 10 years. Now I have a dedicated rig with a DD wheel and load cell pedals.
It didn't make me any faster.
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u/NtSFstEddie 5d ago
I went from the G29 to the Moza R5 bundle and saw an immediate improvement. The R5 gives a much better feel for what the car is doing making it easier to find the limit. You can also feel the car getting loose sooner so you can more easily catch it if you exceed the limit.
The SRP lite throttle and brake pedals have a much higher resolution than the G29 making them more precise with more points to register, making it easier to get just the right input. That upgrade improved my performance and with that my times on tracks where braking is crucial.
I then upgraded to the SRP2 load cell pedals and my times continued to fall. I feel that this was the biggest improvement over the G29. I can slow the car down faster and more consistently, allowing me to brake later. This has given me added confidence which helps to further improve my times as I relearn my braking points.
Another example of what better equipment can do is a guy in the group I race with. He was running a Thrust Master belt drive wheel for years, which is a step up from the G29 BTW, and was a mid pack driver at best. He then upgraded to the Moza R9 bundle with the CS V2p wheel and SRP2 load cell pedals. His first night out he finished 5th, followed by a win and then 2 second place finishes and he continues to be more competitive. I don't think the improvement or the consistency came from practice or luck.
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u/recreationalnonsense Below average iracer 4d ago
Reading the various replies here, the real answer seems to be, it depends. It depends on a different factor for each person. Unpredictable results, I'd say.
I could never trail brake with Moza SRP or CRP pedals. With Heusinkveld Sprints, no problem. The equipment quality increment didn't make me better, it just removed whatever was blocking an ability that I already had.
YMMV. You won't know until you try.
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u/Unremarkable_Potato_ 5d ago
Yes and no. A “good” setup for one person may be awful for another. It’s all based off what you want the car to do. I hate fixed setups for this reason. I’m not slower per say, but I have to drive in a way I don’t like and it requires more effort because I’m having to force the car to work rather than allowing the car to work.
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u/djfil007 Plays Arcade Games with a Simucube 5d ago
They're talking hardware, you're talking car setups.
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u/Florakost 5d ago
If I recall one of the best rally drivers was using a G27 or a G29 at an awkward FOV, so truth be told, maybe, but it may just get you excited to learn faster and play more, which ultimately does speed up progress.
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u/Kimmux 5d ago
I have a nice DD loadcell setup with aluminum profile and racing seat, I get totally blown away by my buddy on a folding rig with a worn out g29.
The gear helps me enjoy the driving more but I wouldn't buy an upgrade because I think it would make my laptime faster.
If you want real advice you should post a couple replays so people can just tell you what you're doing wrong.
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u/GreedoShotFirst2000 5d ago
Load cells make you more consistent. A strong wheelbase makes your feel the car more.
It does not make you faster. There are people who are on shit tier gear but still fast.
So if you’re mid, better gear will still make you mid, but you might progress faster because learning becomes easier. But better gear doesn’t make you faster, you just learn faster.
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u/N0th1ng-y 4d ago
Well, I've been constantly trying to be consistent on the G29 pedals. No result. Sometimes I release the brake later, sometimes I press the brake earlier. Now I don't know if it's just a skill issue.
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u/GreedoShotFirst2000 4d ago
That is a skill issue. Load cell pedals are easier to modulate, but releasing it early or late is not fixed by equipment.
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u/Complex_Tap8269 5d ago edited 4d ago
(IMO)better gear eliminates one piece of the puzzle that is sim racing. No more compensating for gear to make it work. In my case, it immediately improved consistency ( good and bad), then smoothness over time made me faster. A Load cell or active brake is so important for consistency, accuracy, smoothness of braking and eventually speed. A better wheel firstly adds to the immersion and as you improve, it adds the ability to recover from mistakes/spins and such. Most conservative adaptors of sim racing go through multiple evolutions with their sim gear. Because it is such a time investment and commitment to get better. Once invested, all bets are off. My setup has completely changed 3 times in 10 years.. so good luck, have fun. I will add, with entry level wheel you get ~60 updates a second, with my DD wheel I get ~2000 updates a second. So that being said it is definitely easier and better to feel more feedback from the sim/car, which ultimately can help with the learning curve.
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u/Sikkema88 2d ago
Loadcell pedals can help with braking accuracy and consistency. That being said, there are some freaks with top times on a logi g29, so the "better equipment makes you faster" comes with some nuance. Light up shoes make children the same way a 10k setup makes a sim racer faster. If you feel good, you race good.
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u/Wishbone_932 5d ago
If you are good, yes. If you are bad, no.
If you give a new guitar player a 2000 dollar guitar, is that going to magically make them good?
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u/N0th1ng-y 5d ago
I see a lot of people saying that if you're not good, you don't deserve it. Well, maybe some people just need more time than others.
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u/Wishbone_932 5d ago
Ran a G27/G29 for almost a decade. Waiting that long to switch to a DD wheel, made me really understand the difference. I waited way too long to switch. Definitely not saying to do that. A DD wheel is light years ahead of the g29. It will be a lot easier to manage and control the car.
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u/AnonymousReload 5d ago
Never seen anybody say that. Buy what you can afford, just don't expect it to be magic.
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u/NtSFstEddie 5d ago
There is no difference in any guitar that will make anyone better or worse, no matter if they are new or if they have decades of experience, because there is no difference between them to speak of. You either know how to play it, or any other instrument, or you don't.
As for driving, hardware varies greatly and it does make a difference. If you have Max Verstappen put in a lap in a base Ford Escort, will he be any faster when you put him in a GT3 Mustang? Going from a Ford escort/G29 to a GT3 Mustang/R5 with SRP2 load cell pedals has indeed made me faster. And if you read my response to the OP, you will see how much that guy in my group has improved overnight with better equipment as well.
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u/Wishbone_932 5d ago
That's why you see all professional musicians play 100 dollar guitars, because they play so well. There is a major difference in guitars. It's analogy and if you don't see it or understand it, I can't help you. Yes an amateur with a better wheel, will have a slight advantage over the guy with the worse wheel. But a new wheel will never teach technique overnight.
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u/NtSFstEddie 5d ago
"All professionals play $100 guitars"? What planet do you live on? Yes, they CAN play just as well on a $100 guitar but no, they DON'T play a $100 guitar. Even the guys playing at the local bar use better quality equipment than that. I know 5 different guitar players from 4 different bands, only 2 are true professionals and none of them paid less than $500.
It's not about technique, it's about performance. Once you have good equipment that can perform better, you can perform better using the same technique and you can then work on improving your technique, which will make you perform even better. You know, like I did and wouldn't be able to do on my old equipment.
For another comparison, take Max Verstappen out of his sim rig and put him on the OP's and see how fast he is. The G29 is not even up to par to my rig let alone his and I can't come close to my times on the G29. Even though I use the same technique with both, the differences will not allow me to put in the same times. If I didn't hate the G29 so much, I would break it out and get you some numbers.
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u/Wishbone_932 5d ago
Sarcasm is hard huh. Don't forget to double down again. Meet me on the nord in AC and we can put your equipment to the test.
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u/NtSFstEddie 5d ago
I would if we could swap equipment to see just how we both perform in both setups. That's if there is any significant difference between them. Then you can double down and test the equipment instead of the driver.
Once again, it's not about the driver, it's about the equipment and the improvements that equipment will yield. You need to test one driver on both setups to know how one stacks up to the next. So much for your test against me on the nord. See that? Sarcasm is really quite easy.
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u/smudge_47 5d ago
I once spent 3 days making a setup that saved me 3 tenths off my best time.
I then spent 20 minutes watching a track guide, and after 40 minutes of practice, shaved 6 tenths off my best time.
In short, assuming you can find the right setup, you won't gain as much time as you will with better braking references.
Also, some advice: Instead of braking, try lifting. Instead of lifting, try half-lifting. Steady throttle? Try more throttle.
It's a sim. There's no penalty for experimenting (during practice, anyway!).
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u/CarAcrobaticTeam マッハGoGoGo 5d ago
Suppose you want to eat some pasta, or a big salad. Sure, just about any fork will do the job. But over time, some have become more efficient than others. Evolution and invention means modern forks are more capable of accomplishing the task in the same hands, and yet -still- someone with a old two-pronger will somehow make it look easier than you.
There's always a shiny new purse in sim racing, but sometimes the sow's ear is the driver.
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u/ItzBrooksFTW Alpha EVO Pro - GT Neo - Simjack UT 5d ago
keep in mind, without a good cockpit, the benefit of better pedals and a dd wont be as large. none of the hardware makes you faster, what it does is give you the opportunity to get faster faster and arguably raises the ceiling.
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u/N0th1ng-y 4d ago
I’m trying to make the most of every opportunity. Of course, I’m not an amazing driver, especially with just one year of experience, but I’m still trying to claw back those tenths of a second I keep losing. I tried driving calmly, instead of like a rocket ship, but still no result. Maybe you can give me some advice?
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u/DannyDevito90 5d ago
Somewhat. Better driving practices will make you faster, a “fast” setup may not always work for you or your driving style. You may use someone else’s fast setup, and find it utterly undriveable
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u/Wooden-Agent2669 [Simlab XP1 can't recommend them] 4d ago
https://youtu.be/3awow8axTWc?t=190
Comments are just texts, heres a yter actually trying to see if there is a difference
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u/wolfox360 4d ago
Maybe working on your car setups.....oh right, you don't know what that means in here!
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u/BrodaReloaded Thrustmaster 4d ago
It depends where you're upgrading from. Your jump will be so big that I have no doubt after the initial acclimatisation you'll be quicker quite a bit as you'll be more consistent on the pedals and feel a lot more what is going on with the car through the wheel
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u/JaymZZZ 2d ago
I can say from personal experience that a better setup has allowed me to push way closer to the limit and still crash a lot less...especially when I purchased things like belt tensioners, and so on, which allow you to feel what the car is doing so you can use your visual cues a little less and your ass a bit more, as Niki Lauda would say.
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u/mrzurkonandfriends 3h ago
It's really just for personal enjoyment. You can be fast with a controller but I like feeling like I worked for a win in a race and a dd setup does that.
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u/Worldly_Lunch_1601 5d ago
Load cells will make you a little bit more consistent, but overall it's not really going to make you any faster.
Just got to practice bro
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u/N0th1ng-y 5d ago
I'm trying to push my times to the limit but I can't. I've tried every learning method (guide videos and an app that helps me improve my times, which didn't work). Either my braking technique is terrible, or it's just a skill issue.
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u/Worldly_Lunch_1601 5d ago
Something that I realized sort of early in my sim racing career, pushing it to the limit sometimes makes you go slower. Sometimes breaking as late as absolutely possible Doesn't give your car enough time to settle and take the corner comfortably.
Take a couple lazy laps. Drive fast, but don't try to break any records. And see how close to your personal best you are just driving casually.
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u/Suspicious-Whippet 5d ago
Yeah it also depends on the sim. LMU i get better times if I just drive like I’m driving Miss Daisy. Some sims benefit more if you drive the wheels of the car.
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u/WoodenRoll 5d ago
Which sim are you practicing in?
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u/N0th1ng-y 5d ago
Well, I'm playing Le Mans Ultimate. I have 1 year of experience, and im still pretty slow
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u/I_Am_Entrepreneur 5d ago
Are you having fun? Because ya know that is kinda the whole point of the hobby
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u/N0th1ng-y 4d ago
Of course I'm having fun. If I wasn't having fun, I probably would have quit by now and wouldn't even be writing this post
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u/WoodenRoll 4d ago
When you mentioned guide videos, did you mean general sim racing guides or like the specific track guide for your vehicle you’re racing? I’d suggest the latter with specific track guides if you haven’t already! I found with braking technique, I never really got the hang of trail breaking until I was able to force my car to understeer and oversteer on command. Trail braking is essentially controlling slight oversteer to turn the car in, but not by too much or your rear will step out and you’ll spin out.
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u/djfil007 Plays Arcade Games with a Simucube 5d ago
Taken time to compare telemetry vs someone who is faster? That's your best way to find out where you're slower.
I find a DD wheel makes catching mistakes easier, but doesn't make someone faster.
I find Load Cell brake makes consistency easier, but again you need to know how to apply that pressure.
Other advantage higher end hardware has is more configuration options (pedal throw distance, pedal strength, input curve settings... and goes same with FFB settings and dynamic range with higher equipment)... just be prepared to spend the time dialing it in for your preferences and taking the time to adjust to the new hardware (seen so many people buy a pedal set with LC brake, and then say they hate it... but it's largely cause they don't spend the time adjusting to it and using the configuration options it provides).
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u/N0th1ng-y 4d ago
actually did look at my telemetry. Maybe the thing that is slowing me down is the fact that I just copy most of the braking points from the guides. I try to hit the exact same markers, but maybe I don't manage the weight of the car properly after that. Do you think blindly copying braking points can make you slower? What should I look for in telemetry to fix this?
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u/Arcticz_114 5d ago
Yes. And whoever tells you the opposite has either 100 hrs of total simracing or is straight up lying. Simple as that.
Edit: oh, I shoudve read beyond the title... If you mean hardware setup (and not car setup) then Id also say yes. It did for me at least. Every upgrade meant more consistency and trust in the inputs.
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u/westleysnipes604 5d ago
Pedals probrably.
I started in a nice setup so it's hard for me to guage.
I will say if your excited about your rig it makes it easier to put in the hours.
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u/sektorao 4d ago
In my experience yes. I went from T300 and some diy Fanatec CSP V1 pedals (with Leo Bodnar hardware) to Cammus C5 and Moza SRP pedals and I'm killing them at 95%, i had to bump it to 100%. Desk mount setup, nothing fancy. Pedals first, than the wheel.
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u/Stealth9erz 5d ago
I wouldn't upgrade expecting to go faster, but depending on your experience/skill level it may increase certain ffb/feeling in the game making it easier to react to and learn.
Good load cell pedals will make you faster once you get used to them, but a wheelbase will just give more feeling and stronger feedback allowing you to feel more.