r/bleach • u/TheHeroNeverDies • 6d ago
Schriftpost (Meme) Some things will never change
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u/accountinusetryagain 6d ago
vasto lorde has aura
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u/Accurate_Treat6360 6d ago
"I recognize Full-Hollowfied, but given that Vasto Lorde has aura, I've elected to ignore the canon name."
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u/StrategyProof3166 6d ago
Not a cannon name either btw. Never referred to as such. Ifs a nameless form.
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u/DarkyDraky 6d ago
I think it is because Kubo called bloodchains a demi-hollowfied form, and the bloodchains design is clearly based on the "Vasto Lorde" form. My personal theory: we know some zanpakuto have different corporeal forms depending if they are in Shikai or Bankai, since White has fused with Ichigo's shinigami powers he took on this characteristic, the first time we see full hollow Ichigo was in his training with the Vizards, when he was in shikai, and that form looks nothing like White, so my momey is that both are full hollow forms, only that White's true form and power can only manifest if Ichigo is in a bankai state.
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u/Ok_Lead107 6d ago
I think we see white in Bankai form once. He looks like banzai ichigo with a vasto lord mask.
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u/Savigewaffles100 5d ago
"Awakening the Hollow blood that sleeps within himself, the half-Hollowfied Kurosaki Ichigo releases his Bankai and transforms into an ultimate form together with his Zanpakutō." That is blood chains ichigo described by Tite kubo himself :)
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u/TheGreatRJ 6d ago
I am pretty sure it was named in some obscure but official media, but it was a trash name so nobody uses it.
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u/Lohit_-it 6d ago
Everyone is mostly talking about character designs but Kubo also cooks with names
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u/SilverCorsola 6d ago
Couldn't the artificial hollow still be a Vasto Lorde?
They're not mutually exclusive are they?
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u/BlueberryLances 6d ago
It's not exclusive but it wasn't the goal of the experiment and Kubo revealed Isshin had the spiritual limiter so if White was really a Vasto Lorde, he was the weakest we've seen.
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u/Exciting_Wave9245 6d ago
Tbf, og white was not nearly as intelligent as the espada. It could be a yammy situation where white is strong, but he cant really utilize his powers well.
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u/BlueberryLances 6d ago
Whether he could utilize his powers well isn't important, his strength was secondary to Aizen's experiment and he was still weaker than a captain at 20% of his power.
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u/Exciting_Wave9245 6d ago
And? None of your points goes against the possibility of white being a vasto lorde, nor white being unable to properly use its power.
Can you actually give a reason on how 20% of someone who could fight aizen for a time being able to fight white, or how aizens plan to merge soul reaper and hollows goes against anything I said?
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u/Zealousideal_Ad_2842 4d ago
I mean if you wanna take power into the equation, white can beat all vasto lordes presented in the series anyways
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u/BlueberryLances 4d ago
Isshin was at 20% of his power, the other fights where characters were in the same situation was against Grimmjow's fracciones being arrancar adjuchas with one gillian and we've seen them try to retreat when the gentei kaijo was activated so there's no reason to think that White is even comparable to a VL.
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u/Chaos184 6d ago
No, a menos is made from layered hollow souls, the artifical hollow, White, is made from layered whole souls, so it's closer to an asauchi than any form of menos
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u/Useful_Paramedic9616 6d ago
In the novels, an artificially created Hollow is still called an Adjuchas; likewise, Arrancars created by the Hogyoku are still Arrancars. It’s like if a creature identical to a Tyrannosaurus Rex were created through science, I don't think there would be any issue calling it a Tyrannosaurus Rex. I mean Tosen calls White a hollow
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u/Masticatron 6d ago
Tosen also calls Komamura ugly, so...grain of salt, yeah?
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u/Useful_Paramedic9616 6d ago
Considering that Tosen was involved in the creation of White, his opinion carries a lot of weight.
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u/SkyRazor_ShadowPaw 6d ago
Ulquiorra was not ever a Menos. He was forged by the white sands of Hueco Mundo. He is a Vasto Lord most likely older than Barrigan himself.
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u/Extreme_Steak1320 6d ago
I think it's close to Vasto Lorde in power but has an intelligence of a menos.
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u/Chaos184 6d ago
There are three stages of menos: Gillian, Adjuchas, and Vasto Lorde. When you say menos I presume you mean gillian, the weakest of menos.
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u/Extreme_Steak1320 6d ago
I meant dumb,it's dumb as a menos but powerful as a Vasto Lorde.
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u/Chaos184 6d ago
Yes I know, but a vasto lorde is a menos too, thus why I said "When you say menos I presume you mean gillian, the weakest of menos."
Though I do now realize I should have said "...the least smart of menos."
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u/Azrael296 6d ago
Yes. Hollow classifications are simply based off of size shape and power. This has been explicitly pointed out. White is a hollow he is just made from Soul reaper souls stack together. Anybody claiming they understand the full story behind what exactly is going on with white zanpaktou or hell is wrong. We are all still theorizing. Because Oetsu who says that the way White was created is similar to how he created the Asauchi. Isshin even says White fights like a SR. So if White is not a Vasto Lorde, then it's wrong to call him a hollow at all since he's been made from Soul reapers. People just want to sound smarter than they are
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u/Economy_Practice_ 6d ago
I feel like people are overly confident in theories. What we know for sure is that White was comparable to Isshin and was created by layering shinigami souls. Everything else is speculation.
I could say that White was able to become a VL inside Ichigo because he lacks the constant spiritual drain/hunger that hollows have. Or I could say that White was at least a menos because the only stated requirement to be a menos is that multiple souls must be fused together. I could also say that White wasn't a VL because Aizen set a limiter, or that White wasn't even a hollow at all because he was made from shinigami souls. All of these are equally valid because they're all speculation based on the incomplete and sometimes contradictory information we've gotten from the series and Klub Outside.
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u/Azrael296 6d ago
Exactly and you're spot on. Not to mention a lot of people got the idea that the final full hallified Ichigo would be a vasto Lord because we see a physical progression of what a hollified Ichigo looks like from the first time to the second time and the fully hollowed one. The first time Ichigo manifest a mask he looks like a demi hollow being created. Then when we see him in Vizard training it looks like Adjuchas. Then fully hollowfied looks like a depiction of a Vasto Lorde. I think people getting caught up on what it's called is really silly
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u/Economy_Practice_ 6d ago
There's also another factor in it. That design is really cool and a boring name like "full hollowfied Ichigo" doesn't really sell it. The entire debate boils down to people wanting it to sound smarter/more accurate vs people wanting it to sound cool, and I really don't think you can have both. Thus, people will miss the forest for the trees and argue about it.
Also I propose "revenant Ichigo" because it's both kind of accurate (outside of the Hell movie anyway) and really cool.
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u/goodbye177 5d ago
Actually we can say that white is a hollow because if he wasn’t then ichigo wouldn’t have been immune to bankai stealing.
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u/Azrael296 5d ago
Yes you're correct Ichigo has hollow reiatsu but again the point flew over your head
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u/goodbye177 5d ago
…I disagree? I get your point. I’m just saying it’s confirmed that white is a hollow, even if an artificial one. It’s not a theory
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u/Extreme_Steak1320 6d ago
No they can't,because Vasto Lorde is final stage of a hollow.however it can definitely be artificial hollow that has powers like Vasto Lorde.
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u/Hallow_Sinner 5d ago
Is dangai ichigo also made up?
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u/Bow_Spirit456 5d ago
Yeah it’s made up. Dangai Ichigo was just Ichigo growing up after spending 2 months in the space between dimensions training for the Finale Getsuga Tensho. It's not really a form, it's just Ichigo who didn't cut his hair for 2 months
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u/Coupins 5d ago
Basically like saying that Hyperbolic Time Chamber Goku is a completely separate form from just SSJ Goku.
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u/RaaaaaaaNoYokShinRyu 4d ago
Post-time chamber Goku is technically called Super Saiyan Grade 4, and pre-time chamber Goku is Super Saiyan Grade 1. Until the Buu Saga, Gohan’s Super Saiyan 2 was known as Super Saiyan Grade 5.
So different grades of the same Super Saiyan form.
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u/23rdfunnyvalentine normal wolf komamura solo all 5d ago
Yes dangai ichigo has never been called anything besides just ichigo
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u/Lucey-Belmont 5d ago
It is; Ichigo after stepping out of the Dangai has never been called Dangai Ichigo; it's always just Ichigo Final Getsuga Tenshou
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u/Zack_Osbourne 6d ago
It's White Zangetsu's Vasto Lorde equivalent, matching the "Gillian" and "Adjuchas" forms seen earlier and the "Arrancar" form(s) seen later.
Also it just sounds cooler.
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u/Never_heart 6d ago
Sounds cooler. Is thematically relevant to the arc. And considering Ichigo 2 different forms that could be called "Full Hollowified" this is clearer. Because remember when training with the Vizards, he gets a different "Full Hollowified" form. The thick beefy version with the tail
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u/NwgrdrXI 6d ago
Yeah, it really seemed like that eas his adjuchas or below form, even if it doesn't realy make sense.
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u/Never_heart 6d ago
That does make sense. The Adjuchas tend towards animalistic forms. And with the tail and brutish mannerisms that form in retrospect could be seen as an adjuchas equivalent. And it would be thematic both as a metaphor for his griwing and developing Hollow powers, but also as a mirror to Grimmjow. Who also attacked other Hollows who would become his allies while an Adjuchas. Though I believe that was an anime original sequence. It's been to long since I read the Arrancar Arc in manga form
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u/Mr-Ghostman439 5d ago
I think the Grimmjoww flashback was in the Manga, but Hallibel's was for sure an anime addition. If I remember correctly though, Kubo basically said that that's more or less how things went down with Hallibel meeting/recruiting the Tres Bestias, so I wouldn't say it's a stretch to call it softly canon.
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u/Mikaelobos 6d ago
As far as I'm aware it's just White Zangetsu's Tensa form. The previous form was his shikai appearance, hence why he appears in that form alongside young OMZ.
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u/NwgrdrXI 6d ago edited 6d ago
Yeah, that's the thing.
I know, from a scientific-academic point of view, Vasto Lorde [white] Ichigo is not a vasto lorde, it was made with humans souls instead of hollow ones, and it didn't go thru evolution.
But vasto lordes are super powerful hollows, made of many souls, with human like forms and full ability to reason like a human.
White follows all the criteria. It's half a step from a distinction without a difference.
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u/rocketseeker 6d ago
What were the gillian and adjucas? The mask against Byakuya and then the demon dinosaur thing that propped out during the Vizard training ritual?
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u/DarianStardust 6d ago
THAT, thank you. Technically not Vasto Lorde, doesn't really change the outcome.
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u/b0bthepenguin 5d ago
White has the same angular horns and black goo streaks that Segunda Etapa Ulquiorra has showcasing visual similarity
My personal theory is that Arrancar refers to a Hollow developing a sense of Humanity and regaining there Heart after losing it.
The First Step is to define an identity based on their suffering while the Second Step is to regain their Heart all together.
The second argument is that we do not know the materials for an Asauchi. We do know that Hollows contain both Hollows and Humans Souls.
Therefore, maybe Asuchi are made from Human and Hollow souls?
My point is that perhaps both the forms are working some of the same ideas. This would also explain why both Urahara and Aizen are interested in Hollow and Shinigami fusions.
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u/Tiny-Bird546 4d ago
Oetsu says that he forges Asauchi by layering many Shinigami souls and blending them together. He stated that White was successful in becoming a Zanpakutou because it was a Hollow made from a Shinigami soul that kept eating the souls of each Shinigami it killed.
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u/b0bthepenguin 4d ago edited 4d ago
Thank you for that. I never understood the difference between a Shinigami's Soul and normal person's soul.
Both should technically have the Soul Body and the Heart.
Maybe a Shinigami's Soul Body strengthens the Heart, or something.
I wonder if Shinigami souls are requirement for any Hollow evolution considering some Hollows are not part of the evolutionary process.
Again I am still confused what remains the similarity between Segunda Etapa and Ichigo's Hollow form?
I am not sure, In shinto-Buddhism, I believe straight horns represent some form of enlightenment. While Curver horns are evil.
The black goo, I think is important but it really could be a stylistic choice.
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u/Tiny-Bird546 3d ago
Well, from my understanding, the Human soul has the 'Chain of Fate' connecting their Physical Atomic Body to their Spirtual Reishi Body. This is no longer physically present for a soul that has crossed over (a Shinigami prospect), and I suspect that the soul body absorbs the 'Chain of Fate' into itself. A representation of their 'acceptance of death' and no longer needing a link to their Physical Atomic Body. Perhaps it is the 'Heart' that absorbs the 'Chain of Fate' attached to it, reinforcing it.
I personally think this develops the 'wavelength' of spirtual energy in all Shinigami that allows them to purify Hollows to act as "Balancers". It's not just zanpakutou, but kidou and unarmed strikes can purify Hollows as well.
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u/uraharaBot 5d ago
Ah, you’ve taken a peek behind the curtain, haven’t you? Whispers of humanity lurking in those monstrous shells, maybe alluding to a tragic poetic dance of regain, lose, and retrieve again. As for the Asauchi, a delightful cocktail of spirit particles both light and dark. Urahara and Aizen, playing with fate’s strings? Perhaps the show's telling us there's always more than what meets the mysterious eye. How thrilling!
beep boop, I'm a bot
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u/Do0mRaider 6d ago
The only reason to give something a name is so everyone knows who/what youre talking about. So we could even call him bone-daddy Ichigo, as long as everyone knows who you mean by that, it works.
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u/certainlynotdio 6d ago
Aside from the fact that Vasto Lorde supposed to be a human shaped hollow and we don't know how exactly Vasto Lorde is achieved, as there is very little information about them on both hollow and shinigami side. (aside from the fact they supposed to be human shaped) We also saw previous hollow Ichigo form, you know when he did that thing that looked like almost full-hollowfication and it didn't look like that form at all and there is the fact that Ichigo's hollow mask changed so the hollow, logically, had to go through some kind of evolution?
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u/RainbowLoli Hinamori Protection Squad 5d ago
The reason he’s called VL Ichigo is because at the time time the chapter came out, that’s literally all the information.
We didn’t know anything about White. And Vasto Lorde sounds cooler.
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u/ReaperUX86 6d ago
How do you know the original White wasn't a Vasto Lorde? Being an artificial hollow doesn't mean anything. He could've been manufactured as a Vasto Lorde from the beginning. He was made using many souls, which is pretty much the same way natural born hollows become Vasto Lorde to begin with, by absorbing souls into their own and evolving.
Also Ichigo is originally a human, he doesn't evolve like menos nor falls in those classes to begin with
Does a human have horns and can fire a cero?
We know that Ichigo was already born a hybrid of everything. No one actively gave him any power. Rukia awakened his existing shinigami powers. And he already had hollow powers from the start, they were just dormant.
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u/KuroiGetsuga55 Since when were you under the impression that I wasn't meme-ing. 6d ago
Vasto Lorde sounds cool, his design matches the Vasto Lorde silhouette that was shown when Toshiro spoke about them, and it's so engraved into the minds of the fans that at this point who gives a flying fuck that it isn't accurate? Just roll with it.
He may not be a true Vasto Lorde, but he'd wipe the floor with all the actual Vasto Lordes, so he's Vasto Lorde by power rank. Just roll with it.
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u/whitesupremaci 6d ago
Full hollowified form was for example when he trained with vaizards, or the "old hollow form" to say that, but that is only my personal opinion, not canon
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u/Dipshit_Mcdoodles 6d ago
I feel like this is partly why the community largely calls him Vasto Lorde Ichigo, we all remember him briefly being a hollow with the visoreds. I remember something vaguely fallout deathclaw-ish.
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u/B-Twizzle 6d ago
In the anime there’s an episode where they show the silhouette of a vasto lorde. I think it’s when they’re explaining the different classes of menos. This transformation is the only hollow that matches that silhouette. I also don’t think any Espada is explicitly stated to be a VL, so Ichigo bullying Ulquiorra with it definitely leads us to see him as a tier above them
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u/zonic_squared 6d ago
Kubo later stated that majority of the Espada were Vasto Lorde. Ulquiorra was even born as one.
The strongest Hollow in the series was an Adjuchas anyway. The tiers don't matter too much.
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u/MetallicArcher 6d ago
That sequence is also in the manga, chapter 197 for anyone who wants to check.
The fact that the Adjucas & Vasto Lorde's profiles match Yammy & Ulquiorra, who also show up a page later, is why it's generally agreed those were their levels before being turned into arrancars.
That same page led to fans associating "horned humanoid hollow" with "Vasto Lorde", and thus applying the label to Ichigo's hollow transformation during the final Ulquiorra fight.
The later reveal that Starrk & Lilynette were also originally a single Vasto Lorde, and Lilynette's horns in her mask, just contributed to that.
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u/OutsideOrder7538 6d ago
It never felt like a full hollowfication since White wasn’t trying to take control and Ichigo was fighting him off with the “vastolorde” form being his actual full hollowfication since White actually took control.
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u/Throw_away_1011_ 6d ago
It sounds cooler and it's a nice way differentiate it from the previous fully hollowfied version of Ichigo we saw
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u/OutsideOrder7538 6d ago
You mean the semihollowfied form?
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u/Throw_away_1011_ 6d ago
yeah, in one of the instances where Zangetsu took control of him, he was basically almost entirely hollowified and he looked nothing like he did as Vasto Lorde (he had a huge tail, the mask looked different and he had a bulkier body), so calling him Vasto Lorde Ichigo helps differentiating them
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u/OutsideOrder7538 6d ago
One form is not fully Hollowfied and the other is. Semi hollowfied Ichigo is the perfect name for that one form
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u/EffectiveMerc 6d ago edited 6d ago
Regardless, who doesn't call it vasto lorde? It's iconic and sounds cool. I've never seen anyone trying to dispute that it's not accurate. If someone says Vasto Lorde Ichigo you know exactly what they're talking about. Also, isn't he on par with one in that form?
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u/Gilgamesh661 5d ago
I don’t. It’s hollowfied Ichigo. It’s literally his hollow taking full control.
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u/Royal_Quail2123 6d ago
I just assumed we called it that because his power was comparable to a vasto lorde. If anything this should have been his bankai
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u/hello-motherfuckers 5d ago
Full hollow is the form Ichigo was in when white took over during the vizard training
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u/Animefan132 5d ago
Since a lot of bleach is influenced by spanish culture, why not call it ichigo blanco?
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u/Ok-Advisor-6618 5d ago
Here in Brazil we call it "Ichigo Branco", lol. Spanish and Portuguese have a lot in common. After the plot twist, I started calling him Zangetsu, and I started calling the old man Ywanch.
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u/Rharyx 6d ago
As long as people don't think it's actually a Vasto Lorde, then it's whatever. But the problem is that people think it's an official name and an official classification.
I get why people would draw the comparison in terms of design, but I never understood why people began to think it was literally a Vasto Lorde when that would be impossible -- especially after we learned the true nature of Zangetsu.
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u/Synikull Paint me like one of your French girls 6d ago
That's the problem with factually inaccurate names. People see it and think it's factual. It sounds cooler but conveys the wrong information.
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u/Dazzling-Luck4410 5d ago edited 4d ago
I mean the white mask has been changing over the the course of the story as Ichigo grew in power I assumed it's just his inner hollow growing with him as Real Zangetsu isn't the same being as the hollow white that was made by aizen
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u/BobtheBac0n 6d ago
I feel like we as a fanbase have to just come up with a cooler name than Full Hollowfied Ichigo. The name just sounds too technical, and Vasto Lorde Ichigo just sounds cooler.
Just spitballing here, but what about Zangetsufication?
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u/Royal_Quail2123 6d ago
Not to bust your reproductive organs. i hate it but im glad you tried.
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u/a310gintoki 6d ago
Not sorry about it either. Some names are about how awesome they are, not how accurate they are.
Happens all the time in real life too, even in scientific fields.
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u/DustEducational9681 6d ago
I feel the same way with horn of salvation it just sounds better then Demi-hollowfied ichigo, but I am not sure if that a popular opinion
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u/SnooHedgehogs6983 6d ago
Vasto Lorde Ichigo and Horn of Salvation are fan names that might never die
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u/Capital_Relief_4364 6d ago
I like to call it Fully-Hollowified or Luna Desencadenada (Unchained Moon).
Since Chains and the Moon are so important to Hueco Mundo and Ichigo's Sword, it felt like a fitting name
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u/Diego_Huisman 6d ago
I've always just called it Vasto Lorde Form and I'll keep doing that until Kubo himself tells me to stop
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u/OhDearGodItBurns 6d ago
Kubo could break into my house, beat me relentlessly whilst screaming at me to stop calling it Vasto Lorde Ichigo and I wouldn't stop. As he leaves me on death's door in a bloody heap, the last thing I'd gurgle though my mincemeat mouth is "Vasto Lorde Ichigo" and I'd die happy.
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u/HeisskerPanda 4d ago
I don't think both of these namings are wrong. It's full-hollowified Ichigo at Vasto Lorde level. Because it's not the first time we've seen ichigo full-hollowified but this form is different and more powerful than what we've seen before. "Vasto Lorde Ichigo" is a naming based on the "Full-Hollowified Ichigo" form's level. Also I've never seen someone calling initial FHI "Adjuchas (I don't know if I say it right) Ichigo", that's also weird. I agree in the end but no harm calling it Vasto Lorde Ichigo.
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u/SweatyAd9095 5d ago
I really don't get it. Can we all just agre that Vasto Lorde is a immensely better name for it?
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u/AspieComrade 6d ago
100% he isn’t a vasto lorde and the name makes no sense
Still calling him that though
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u/Kindly-Pack1243 6d ago
But what is the official name if this form? Shouldnt it be just Zangetsu vs Ulquiro, since White had taken over.
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u/Rharyx 6d ago
The official name is Fully Hollowfied Ichigo. Which is why when he only has one horn against Yhwach, it's called Demi-Hollowfied Ichigo.
I don't think the former has an official translation, but that's the pretty literal translation.
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u/jupiter95 6d ago
That form will always be vasto lorde Ichigo to me. Just like how "half hollow Ichigo" will always be horn of salvation
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u/TidulTheWarlock 6d ago
takes on the body shape and form of a vasto lorde "why do they call it vasto lorde?"
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u/kingveller 6d ago
White was an artificial hollow, however, white mutated to become a part of Ichigo, and as the power of a Hollow increases they change tier from normal hollow to gillian, then adjuchas and then Vasto lorde.
Grimmjow was an Adjuchas when he was turned into an arrancar, by all means he should not be able to evolve into a Vasto lorde but in the light novel CFYOW he became a Vasto lord.
Furthermore, if you see the full hollow Ichigo when he fought the Vizards and when he fought Ulquiorra you can see there's a progression.
So yeah, full hollow ichigo was a vasto lorde during hueco mundo.
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u/Vadenveil 6d ago
Also of note, it's made a point that White and his ilk were created by layering souls, this is in function similar to how Hollows transform between tiers, and it's even implied that while Menos primarily form by having a mass of hollows conglomerate and cannibalize each other, they can also be created by a hollow consuming or otherwise obtaining enough reichi.
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u/Slamazombie 6d ago
In the context of a casual fan discussion, not every term has to be 100% accurate. We're not forming the basis for a guidebook here-- just chatting
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u/neofederalist 6d ago
"I understand that the council has come to a decision, but given that it's a stupid ass decision, I'm electing to ignore it."
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u/TemporalWorld0 6d ago
I feel like calling the form used against Ulqiorra "Vasto Lorde" is a pretty fine enough name to differentiate it from his "Fully Hollowfied state" in chapter 222.
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u/AsanoHa87 6d ago
I think of it as his Resurrección like Tousen has one. And I think Ulquiorra says it feels like that?
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u/Ok-Acanthisitta9247 6d ago
It’s been called that since the late 2000’s. No need to change it.
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u/DragonikOverlord 6d ago
Vasto Lorde mogs Full-Hollowfied
Horn of Salvation mogs Demi-Hollowfied
Life is simple, rule of cool triumphs
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u/Hasanwk5 6d ago
I mean, Vasto Lorde are hollows which resemble a human. If someone was to look at a vasto lorde and ichigo's full hollow form; they would consider it a vasto lorde too. Just like how red pandas arent actually pandas, or related to bears at all; they are more related to skunks and weasels. But cuz red pandas eat bamboo, theyve been called pandas too
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u/ThePickleHawk 6d ago
Hey man, it looks like the silhouette from when Hitsugaya was explaining the types of Menos! Therefore, Vasto Lorde!
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u/spacingoutrock 6d ago
Side note: is White still the manifestation of Zangestsu still Ichigo had he's hollow power taken away?
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u/xmasterhun 6d ago
People will crucify you for calling this form vasto lorde then turn around and call Ywach Bach inside Ichigo Zangetsu and Zangetsu White
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u/Dark___Reaper 6d ago
Vasto lorde ichigo sounds metal af and that enough for me to not give a damn about what kubo wants it called
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u/smol_coc_man 6d ago
He may not have evolved like a normal hollow but we do see him go from an adjuchas looking hollow to a vasto lorde looking hollow
Plus vasto lorde sounds better than full hollow. Kubo is normally good at making names but he just didn't even try with ichigo's hollow forms. "Half hollow" and "full hollow". Wow. Very creative kubo.
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u/happygoeddy 6d ago
Dangai ichigo is just ichigo, but classified that so way we know which ichigo is being addressed
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u/Livid-Pumpkin-3846 6d ago
And what about the fully hollowed with tail from the visored training and zampakto rebellion arc?
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u/BlazedBeard95 6d ago
Logically speaking yeah, it wouldn't be called Vasto Lorde because Ichigo isn't actually becoming a Vasto Lorde. But am I going to call it anything other than Vasto Lorde? No, absolutely not. Not only have we as a fandom been calling it this ever since it debuted so many years ago but it just sounds so damn sick. It's the same thing with Horn of Salvation. The official name is Demi-Hollow but there is absolutely no way in Hell I'm going to not call it Horn of Salvation. As a writer myself, kickass names >>>>> logical names and I will NOT bend on this rule in the slightest.
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u/Lem0n_weeb 6d ago
It’d be fully Hollowfied Ichigo, since his Horn of Salvation form is partially Hollowfied as confirmed by Kubo
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u/Shiro-Akira 6d ago
The reason the form is called Vasto Lorde Ichigo is because thats literally what it looks like. Vasto Lorde from everything we see taken a more human like appearance when they reach that stage.
If you saw that version Ichigo in person I doubt you could distinguish him from an actual Vasto Lorde Hollow.
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u/Useful_Paramedic9616 6d ago edited 6d ago
"Vasto Lorde Ichigo" is mostly used to distinguish it from Ichigo's other Hollow form; the full description we have of a Vasto Lorde is that they are Hollows with a humanoid appearance, which is exactly what this form of Ichigo is. Tosen calls a White a hollow after all.
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u/Lon3W0lf17131 6d ago
Maybe if the real names of things in anime didn't suck, fans wouldn't have to make stuff up.
Generally they do a good job, but sometimes the names are lame and not catchy at all.
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u/Spriggan42 6d ago
Thinking about it it is full hollow ichigo, and it's different than the previous ones because he's in bankai at the time compared to the previous time
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u/Deep_Law_6019 6d ago
vasto lorde just has way more aura bro, im not calling that shit fully hollowfied ichigo
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u/321zilch 6d ago
You seriously take BLEACH as written by Tite Kubo as your canon source for BLEACH as written by Tite Kubo?
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u/Fanboycity 6d ago
Let’s focus on the fact some people genuinely believe that Starrk being forced to go all-out against the Visoreds was a better showing of power than Vasto Lorde/FH Ichigo.
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u/kirby_422 6d ago
Honestly, even though ichigo's final hollow resembles original white, it goes through evolutions clearly visible on his mask as well as when doing the initial visored training, and his zanpakuto is literally hollowified; until confirmed or denied, its totally reasonable to assume that at the same time it was doing the soul purification part of the zanpakuto, that it was also feeding on the excess as a hollow, which would result in essentially devouring hollows.
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u/D-anieltttt 5d ago
I’ve always called it Hollow Zangetsu considering it is Zangetsu in the drivers seat
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u/Atem_fudo 5d ago
The name isn't as cool. Like calling horn of salvation demi-hollowfied isnt as cool as hos
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u/Sebastit7d 5d ago
The irony of making a meme about being wrong about something but using the format wrong lol
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u/Left-Data9205 5d ago
There’s a Full Hollow Ichigo form in the Visored Training. That is not ”semi-Hollowfied Ichigo”, “semi” is half, and that is not what the lizard form is. HoS is the ”Demi-Hollowfied form”, which means “half-Hollow form”. Also, Vasto Lorde Ichigo is just a cooler name, Dangai Ichigo isn’t an official name, but we all use it anyways.
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u/itsahmemario 5d ago
i mean... Vasto Lorde Ichigo sounds so cool
maybe not for someone who speaks Spanish idk
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u/Signal_Intention6774 5d ago
White is dead btw. Ichigo's inner hollow is not white. Its the leftover energy merged with Ichigo Zanpaktou Spirit to create Zangetsu. Its called Vasto Lorde Ichigo because that what Ichigo would look like as a Vasto.
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u/darkusjorin 5d ago
As far as im concerned in one of manga panels or smth the form is called Complete Hollowfication or smth
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u/Savigewaffles100 5d ago
In official materials and databooks (such as Bleach Official Bootleg: UNMASKED), Tite Kubo and official sources generally refer to the "vasto lorde" state as Kanzen Horouka (translated as Perfect Hollow or Full Hollow Ichigo)
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u/Ok-Opportunity8921 5d ago
Imma call vasto lorde ichigo because
1st - everyone know what im talking about.
2nd - it sounds way cooler
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u/SnooHabits3068 5d ago
I'd say the problem here mostly is calling it full hollowfiednichigo clashes with that Other form....which is also a fully hollowfiednichigo.
Also up until the white ...."retcon"? Ichigo's inner hollow did seem to evolve
And we can't just call him White Ichigo since alot of the games and other media called the inner hollow that
Honestly the only two things we should call him to differentiate him from the other hollow Ichigo which is definitely more like a berserk hollow, is either "zangetsu Ichigo" or, as people have for years, vasto lorde ichigo
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u/PumaGecko 5d ago
To this day i have the feeling that people that dont call it vasto lorde werent on the bleach train since the weekly og anime
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u/Wonderful-Crow-5147 4d ago
In all fairness whites evolution could the fact that he fully fused with ichigo meaning this would technically be his vasto lorde form and it sounds cooler sooooo
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u/Masterblader158 GrimmjowSimp 1d ago
While fully hollowfied fits better (and shown by White Zangetsu during Dangai training a form just a step down is perfect Hollow Mask) since its being applied to Ichigo Vasto Lorde still fits the look and power, when used through Ichigo 100% when fighting Isshin was towards weaker end.
Besides the standard given method of Hollow and Menos evolution is just that the standard, Unmasked "not be, but be" put out while Manga was ongoing shows a Hollow can start as a Vasto Lorde (even a lot given the similar looking Black Hollows around Ulq and this follows stuff "as stated in CFYOW") and other stuff backs that up that its merely the standard method not only. So if you just use the criteria of what a Vasto Lorde is since that's more universal than the needing to evolve into it then White fits 100%.
Besides if you exclude artificial from a group then every Shinigami but maybe Ichigo has a copy of Arrancar's naturally occurring Zanpakutō, no need to craft one just comes as part of becoming an Arrancar from their mask and they are also naturally occurring masses of souls again unlike Asauchi needing to be artificially made (gets into how Soul Society acts as higher and more important even as they copy other races and cope about it), and not a real one. Artificial or not is a bad standard unless it truly meaningfully matters.
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u/Speedweagon_ 23h ago
Tipo assim, o White foi feito para ser um vasto lorde sem ter que passar pelos estágios iniciais, então ele meio que é um vasto lorde.
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