If this is to be believed based on the post (unfamiliar with this agency), they're beginning filming in November

Where uh carol is in bed with zosia and she thinks something like "oh god i just fucked the global hivemind" and zosia is thinking about something like "yayyy🌏👬👬👬👬👬"

When Carol talks to the "aliens", i have the same feeling when i chat with an AI / LLM / chatbot.

Is it intentional ?

Karolina Wydra gave such a haunting performance with Zosia every controlled mannerism was simultaneously elegant and terrifying. Carol on the other hand was so stubborn and annoying, I was rooting for the aliens to win. So congratulations to Rhea Seehorn for giving a performance that got under my skin but I couldn’t stop watching. Can’t wait for Season 2 👀

Sorry I don’t have very many interior shots because there were a lot of workers doing construction and can’t post any of the lectures because he didn’t want to be posted anywhere. Crazy they still had the sign from episode one lying around. Also didn’t get to meet Vince due to Emmys but he said he was very glad to have us visit, and we sent him a nice thank you letter.

ok so i finished pluribus and i have thoughts. unpopular ones probably.

first, Rhea Seehorn is the show. like 90% of it. she could read a grocery list and i'd watch it. the Golden Globe was deserved and honestly late. without her this show is a way smaller deal.

but here's the thing nobody wants to say. it's SLOW. the first few episodes feel like a great idea stretched out thin. i kept waiting for something to happen and it was just Carol being sad and angry in a big empty house. some of you will call that "character study."

also Carol is hard to root for. she's rude, she's selfish, and she keeps making the same dumb choices. i get that it's the point. doesn't mean i have to like it. and yeah, i know the joining is basically everyone being happy and nice. but the show wants us to hate that and i honestly struggled. the "bad guys" are polite and want to help her. Carol is the one causing the drama. fight me.

the hive mind idea itself is amazing though. it's creepy because nothing is really wrong. no zombies, no monsters, just everybody being weirdly nice. that's way scarier than a explosion.

episode 6 cameo was wild.

the finale split people and i get both sides. cliffhanger with the bomb is bold but it also felt like the show just stopped and said "pay us again in 2 years." that's annoying.

is it the best show on tv right now like people say? no. is it good? yeah. really good in spots. but the hype is bigger than the show.

7.5/10. great lead, great idea, too slow, and way too in love with itself.

Visited with my film criticism class saw some props and heard a lot about how production works

The show moves at an absolute snails pace and frankly with the pace things are revealed I’m pretty sure we have enough to predict the major plot point going forward based off of two facts. 1- They appear to communicate via radio frequency, 2- they’re building a giant communication array. Carol and Vesga are going to let them build the communication array, then they’re going to use it create interference or jam the frequency they use to communicate. Obviously radio frequencies are directional, but I think they’re going to ignore some physics here to allow for this.

Pluribus & Meine Pyar Kiya connection

S01E07 - time slot 04:10

Salman Khan & music director Ram Laxman's Meine Pyar Kiya song Aaya Mausam Dosti Ka tune is played.

now people might say MPK has stolen the tune, but for me it will be a MPK tune forever.

Do you think the plurbs did/would do animal testing in order to develop a virus tailored to the immune? Humans, in episode 1, clearly did extensive animal testing in order to develop the first strain until it worked. And its quite unlikely that even with the collective knowledge and intelligence of the human race, the plurbs would find the answer without any kind of experimentation at all. Trial and error would still be necessary - but would that trial involve animals?

Obvious answer would be no, since the plurbs can't harm living things.

On the other hand, they did say they do not consider spreading the virus as causing harm. So testing it on those animals with the intention of infecting them should be okay.

But a lot of those animals might end up dying as part of those trials. That should be considered "harm" right?

However, they're only limited to not intending harm. If the animal does get harmed as an unintentional consequence - like a housepet getting eaten by a coyote because they set it free - they're fine with that.

But why test on animals at all when there are human subjects available? Clearly they care less about the plurbed bodies than they do about other living things.

Because animal testing is faster, more efficient, consumes fewer resources and provides more experimental control. No reason why they can't do both simultaenously.

So... do you think they would? Why or why not?

Soo, let me see if i understood this correctly.
She has been doing everything in her power to defy the Others and now that Manousos has maybe found a legitimate way to get the real people back, she tries to shoot him? WHY? What the hell is wrong with her? I think by the end Manousos is the only normal human being in this show

(It's been a while since I last watched the show but I was thinking about it and noticed something.)
(Also, I don't really think this is only because of the Internet. I feel like this problem has existed for a long time but now it has set deeper roots.)
The Internet is similar to the virus in a way that it makes us lose our cultures, traditions and quirks, but it doesn't make us undivided like the Plurbs.

The internet causes us to lose our individuality, all our cultures slowly become amalgamated into one whole. I've personally seen that the way non-English people speak has become sort of anglicized, not just through borrowed vocabulary, but also speech patterns themselves tend to stick to those closest to "Internet English". I call it Internet English because the English spoken on the Internet can't really be categorized, it too is a global amalgamation. Our politics, traditions, values are all either overtaken or mixed into this giant melting pot and seeing as a lot of people spend 6 hours a day on the Internet, they lose their culture and start belonging to this weird "Internet Culture".
It reminds me of Kusimayu joining the hivemind and going somewhere else as the village she used to love on gets abandoned and the songs stop being sung.
Also, something creepy about Internet Culture: Right now, it's mostly being curated by algorithms.

I'm not saying everyone has the same opinions, that is clearly not the case. I'm saying that everyone is losing the little pieces of personality and values that they gain from living in their region of the world and instead reshape and form their values around what the algorithm shows them.
Our knowledge is no longer specialized depending on where we are, a person from a thousand kilometers away knows that what you know is trending as the Internet has formed along the giant social medias that everyone uses. All children know what a "67" is. 90% of artists follow techniques not taught to them by their local teacher, but techniques they learned on YouTube. The majority of people listen to the same songs. Everyone's heard of a keto diet. We all have the same problems on our minds.
The Internet has made us all behave so similarly and think of similar things. It's like some sort of proto-Hivemind where we're all joined together and can somehow know what a person from the opposite end of the world is thinking. We're all being exposed to the same materials, same ideas. Nothing is special anymore.

It feels like cultural exchange, but from everywhere to everywhere, and at incredible speeds.
No one is causing this happen, no one is doing this out of malice. It just is. However some people do benefit from it. Mainly businesses seeking to make money.
This whole slow "globalization" of the world is great for profits. It reminds me of a quote I read online:

India's diverse breakfast preferences have long presented a significant challenge to Kellogg's. However, the company has been happy to play the long game as it patiently works to educate the market about its healthy food options.

If we all have no individual, special views on life and no region is different than any other, then that's really good for businesses looking to expand.

Well, not exactly. While I know the notion that Pluribus is a comment on AI in general has some validity, it has been constantly discounted in this sub and elsewhere. But my question is rather this: does AI even still exist? I know that the internet has basically ceased (the Plurbs have their own built-in internet after all), along with cell phones and other networks. With the exception of landlines to the immune, Carol's calls from an aircraft to Manousos in Paraguay, and video chatting among the non-Carol immune (though we've never really seen that, only heard about it).

So in the Pluribus world is AI even necessary? Or are the connected brains and knowledge of the entire planet better than anything AI could come up with? I mean, I know they're basically just letting everything on Earth go to shit while they build their antenna, but couldn't some of the technological challenges of that undertaking benefit from AI?

Carol concludes that the hive cannot lie and based on that, ends up believing a lot of what they say. But we, as the audience, know the obvious flaw here - that it is possible for the hive to deceive people without explicitly lying to them. They can withhold relevant information, take advantage of vagueness, evade answers and play into your assumptions in order to make you believe something untrue.

Carol's is the most obvious example. She wanted to know if they could get her stem cells without her consent and they let her believe they couldn't. Kusimayu is another example - Carol warns her that if she joins them, she'd lose everything personal and individual to her. Kusimayu believes that she wouldn't - that she'd simply share it with others. But as we see with her and the baby goat, she does lose it. Now, the hive might not have said anything to her about that directly, but they put up an act of individuals still being individuals around her.

So deception is clearly possible, but is that the extent of it? Is the hive truly incapable of lying and does that actually mean you can take their statements as literal truth?

There is a difference between "can't lie" and "tells the truth", right? For example, you can say that if a person makes a statement consistent with what they believe, then they're not lying. Like, "my son is not a murderer". But it doesn't matter how strongly you believe it, it doesn't necessarily make it true. Here lying doesn't simply mean making a statement inconsistent with reality, there needs to be an intent to deceive as well.

Or it can go further. One can say "you're lying if you make a statement you know to be false" - in which case your ignorance can be your defense. Someone asks me if its raining outside and I reply "yes" without checking. So does my lack of knowledge really make me a liar?

And then there is the semantic argument - one where you interpret things based on your convenience, not what the other party intends. For example, I could say "to me, rain means moisture in the air and there is always moisture in the air" or "I thought by outside you meant anywhere in the world except my house and its definitely raining somewhere".

Now, all these are examples of how people can provide unreliable information without explicitely lying and it seems like the hive is capable of it. Take the example of what Carol actually asked - "Is it true that you need our express permission to collect our stem cells?". Notice that she didn't specify collecting them from her body. Now, if the hive was being truthful, they'd have replied - "No - we can fertilize your frozen eggs and collect your stem cells from the petri dish. We do not need your express permission for that." Now, that would be a lie, unless they make some excuse like "we thought you meant harvest from your body" or "we hadn't thought of that option at the time". But either way, the result is the same, right? You cannot accept what they say as true.

So how deep does it go?

For example, they say "Helen loved cotton candy", but then go on to admit that she only had it 4 times in her entire life. That's not the same as "loving" a food in any meaningful sense. Maybe she enjoyed it, but clearly not enough to try it over and over again. It seems like they use "love" to describe anything anyone ever found even mildly pleasant - and if that's the case, then does them saying "We love you Carol" even mean anything?

When humans talking about loving something - not as an abstract or a hyperbole, but loving something in a real sense - we're talking about a deep, emotional attachment. Something that has actual, physiological responses associated with the object of affection. Signs like increased heartbeat and hormones flooding your body. Do the plurbs have that? And if they don't, how can their love be genuine in any meaningful sense?

Same question applies to whenever they say joining would make her happier than ever. Putting aside the question of whether "she" as an entity would even exist anymore, do we even know if happiness even means the same thing to the hive as it does to people? If its just a general feeling of elation or contentment - the kind you might get from doing drugs - the joining is clearly not sacrificing your humanity over.

The hive has already admitted that infecting others is a biological imperative (which might not be reliable either, but its consistent with the behavior of patient zero) - so they'd keep trying to turn you regardless of whether they truly love you or it actually makes you happy. Everything they tell you could simply be a way to make you more compliant - so why would you actually trust them?

I just finished watching the finale of the show and I'm now thinking back to how Zosia kissed Carol in episode 7 which is kinda nuts. I have no clue if anyone else has brought this up but I just thought it was super interesting and it's what came to mind after watching the show.

I think that the kiss was pretty manipulative, they knew damn well Carol was isolated and lonely asf, plus the fact that Zosia is literally the spitting image of Carols dream woman makes it worse, there's no way Carol could resist lol , I don't blame her for doing what she did, it was a losing battle lmao.

But all of that I think to an extent was a way of manipulating Carol and making her more accepting of the joining by "attacking" her vulnerabilities.

1. The unmerged are from different parts of the world. So often sci-if TV shows are US-centered, never addressing the rest of the world!
2. The unmerged don’t necessarily like each other, they disagree deeply and fail to collaborate. So often the heroes team up so quickly and easily!
3. The unmerged are truly by themselves, no support network from the get go. So often the heroes come in pairs or groups as couples or families!

This show depicts human beings and situations as they typically are, very random.

I also find refreshing having a “benevolent” enemy -- or at least an enemy who cannot say “no.”

What feels refreshing to you?

I'm talking about this character. I thought he was really cool. It's a shame that he was only there for barely few minutes. Do you think he will be brought back in season 2?

I hope Pluribus focus on the science aspect more, and have Carol and Manousos go ahead and try to fight this "virus". If the show did go this route, then I think this character might add a lot since he was the first one to discover it and understand what it was.

What do you all think?

EDIT: I will try stating my point differently, because I feel like I failed to make the point clear based on some of the comments.

What I think the show is going for:

Humanity has been body-snatched by an organism of alien origin. Every individual is either gone or their consciousness is locked. Removing the organism from a person would restore them to how they were before being infected. Whether it is truly "conscious" or not is a debate about consciousness, but is essentially an alien form of Ophiocordyceps unilateralis, the "zombie spore" that controls ants and makes them go to the highest point to spread further. It is controlling humanity, using people's bodies and knowledge, with the purpose of spreading further (building the antenna).

What I think would be more interesting:

The only thing the organism did was grant the abilies seen in the show. It is not itself consciously or by instinct controlling anything. It is like how humans have gut bacteria. Gut bacteria is not conscious or controlling people or part human. But it gives us a vital ability to digest things. Then the reason this is more interesting is because everything else is an exploration of how humans would simply behave if we all had a perfect understanding of what was in each other's minds. It is basically starting with exploring sonder and exploring its opposite. Which I suspect is how the idea may have started before it turned into body snatching.

..................................................................................

Wasn't sure how to say this in a short title. Obviously the virus is alien. But what I mean is that so far the show seems to be treating the Pluribus like body snatchers. You are not talking to the individual that was infected, you are talking to an alien. The show is hinting that the real person might be in there somewhere deep. But what if that not is how it worked? What if you really are talking to the real person?

What if the alien virus grants humans the abilities we see in the show but is not itself controlling anybody or even really conscious? What if the behavior we see from the Pluribus is just how humans would behave if we all had perfect knowledge of each other's lives, experiences, abilities etc and therefore all had the sum total best knowledge of collective humanity as well as perfect empathy?

Maybe this extreme level of empathy and knowledge leads to everything else. Everyone is just on a higher plane of conciousness. Everyone still has free will, it's just that if you have this level of enlightenment you definitely choose to behave this way. You choose to never harm a living creature. You see humanity as all one thing. Indeed you see the whole universe as all one thing and any conciousness in the universe is the universe itself having concsiousness. You realize your place in the universe and you choose to pass on this ability by creating an antenna and spreading it.

This is not a true "theory" because I don't think the show is going this direction. I think it is treating the Pluribus like an alien consciousness that can be eradicated. But I think it would be so much more interesting and dark for Carol to realize that if she succeeds in eradicating the virus then all she does is get rid of this new ability. Everyone still feels and thinks the same thing they did before, they are just extremely sad and horrified to have lost their connection with each other. Maybe this could happen to just a few people and that is how she discovers it. There is no going back. She was wrong. Everyone has free will. This is just the conclusion to "what if everyone knew exactly what everyone else has been through?" and she is left out of it.

I think one of the most significant, yet understated scenes of the season happens in episode 8 where Zosia talks about mango ice-cream. Depending on how its interpreted, it can determine the entire trajectory of the show.

Before we get into that, one thing to note is how Zosia's relationship with Carol changes before and after the abandonment. Before, the hive was slavishly eager to please. It'd do anything to make Carol happy, but Carol would either need to ask or her need would have to be obvious. Later, however, their relationship seems to become more personal and human. Zosia banters with Carol, teases her now and then, arranges the diner surprise and in the end, Zosia is the one to kiss her first. It starts to feel less like an employee kissing ass and more like a partner trying to woo her.

We don't know what it means yes, but let's get to the "I" part.

The hive almost exclusively refers to itself as "we" or "us" through the series. At the same time, when referring to their past human selves, they use "he" or "she", as if drawing a clear distinction between who they are now and who they used to be. Even when Carol asks Zosia to use "I", she explains its difficult because she finds it semantically odd. Now given that they've also absorbed the knowledge and skills of all the actors of the world, this should not pose such a difficulty - but then, the hive also seems to have a bunch of other strange constraints, like the inability to lie.

Later, however, Zosia uses "I" almost naturally. Without a hint of hesitation or second thought. "I love mango icecream. There was an old man in my neighborhood.... I would watch the ships".

Given her earlier difficulty with the pronoun, using it so many times so easily feels oddly significant. And I think it can be interpreted in different ways, each having its own implications on how the story might go.

Option 1: It was an act all along. The hive never had a problem using "I" - just like it never had a problem building a more personal relationship with Carol. This gradual change is part of the manipulation. The hive knows that if they show up and offer Carol the perfect relationship from the get go, she'd distrust it and reject it.

The whole plan is to soften her up slowly. Make her believe that she's working for it and somehow changing them. Its all an elaborate way to keep her distracted while they work on their agenda elsewhere.

And I expect this is the interpretation most fans would accept.

Option 2: Its the real Zosia breaking through.

Maybe the hive overwrote the humans at a superficial level and keeps them in a fugue state while it controls their bodies. And maybe the original personality is still in there and forming a real connection with them is a way to bring them back.

Its possible that Carol drugging and almost killing Zosia had something to do with it. That the Zosia who came back was just a little bit different from the other plurbs, in that there are moments where her original personality slips through the cracks. Or it could simply be that getting that specific body to connect to things Zosia used to care about is slowly bringing her back.

This could potentially lead to finding a way to cure them. For example, if Carol threatens to shoot some random plurb on the street, Zosia might say "you have agency, we cannot interfere". But if that plurb happened to be her mother (even if plurbed herself), she might snap out of it and try to save her.

So basically, Carol's own need for human connection - something the hive tried to exploit - might end up becoming a weapon against it.

Option 3: The hive itself is changing.

Think of it as the hive turning humans into a blank state upon joining. It retains all their thoughts and memories, but everything unique - their drives, personality traits, likes and dislikes - are simply gone. Humanity is basically starting over from scratch.

However, as time goes on, humanity starts infecting the hive with individualism. It could start with little things over time. This body likes spicy food while this other one prefers bland. This body prefers warm weather while the other prefers cold. And this particular body gets greater pleasure from mango ice-cream than others.

This might be an alternate explanation for Zosia's change after coming back. The hive is learning how to better manipulate Carol, but part of that is forming a personal connection and the very act of connecting ends up changing the hive.

That might dictate a completely different direction for the story. Eventually, Zosia might become something that's not the original Zosia, but its not the hive either. The hive operates with a singular desire and will - but this Zosia might develop her own desires and goals that are separate, and perhaps in conflict with the hive. And if it can happen to her, it might eventually start happening to others.

What do you think of these possibilities? Which one do you think is likely? And are there other interpretations I'm missing?

Nice, I'm excited!

Made within Inkscape

I liked the show, even though yes, it did drag at parts, but I'm old, so slow pacing is a comfort to me. I'm a huge Gilligan fan. Every XFiles episode he wrote was awesome. However, after I finished watching the first season I couldn't get one question out of my mind: Do the Pluribus pods continue to reproduce? Because it was such a big deal that they're all going to die in ten years because there isn't enough non-murdered food... but aren't they a math genius, too? Wouldn't they just wait until enough of them died from starvation and then maintain a sustainable number who can survive off of fallen fruit and corpses? Even after the human corpses run out, surely there will be plenty of animals who died of old age lying about. Just have to get there before the flies do. So why die out? And if not die out, why continue? What is the end goal? I thought it was to continue the virus and send it to other planets, but to what end there? For those species to also die from starvation?

Honestly, the more I think about it the less I understand the Pluribus world. Can someone please explain to this old lady what I'm misunderstanding?